You need to get high bro.

Judeo-Christian. And that's better expressed as Wesetern Monotheistic--Islam is part of the 'Judeo-Christian' tradition, and Muslims worship the same God.

You're making broad statements that not even all prominent Christian theologians throughout history would agree with. Go check out the Deists, or the notion of a "clockmaker God" who creates, puts the creation into motion, and then steps back.

So are you going to worship me as the Son of God? Your earnestness is commendable, and you have a right to be offended by the essay, but you're making terrible arguments. It would be better and more convincing to simply respond with a profession of faith.

This sounded good....

....but this directly contradicts it and demonstrates that you don't really feel that way even though you know it's the 'correct' view.

Archeology can tell us certain things. Locations of cities, distances vs. time, how people lived. Such information is very important even to Biblical scholars so they can understand parts of the Bible that make reference to people, places and events that have been lost to history.

You know, you're mixing up the Old Testament, the Gospels, Milton's Paradise Lost and Dante's Inferno here.

And there are a lot of Christians that would tell you that believing anything could have existed before Adam and Eve is blasphemous and that carbon dating of the Earth and the fossil record are all either Satanic trickery or a test of faith.

Would you feel that way if our laws were grounded in Islamic sharia rather than the Deist sensibilities of our Framers, or in a dogmatic atheism? No, you would agitate for change.

To suggest that what John Ashcroft and his ilk represent is in keeping with what the Framers and the revolutionary generation wanted for this country is a farce. They wanted religion kept out of politics for a reason: it was being used to oppress them by the Crown. The same thing happens in our society when we go too far in relaxing the separation of church and state.

Wrong. Not every country has single state religion--in fact the United States does not. By Constitutional decree. And the linkage you make to language is telling. Guess what: not every has a single national language either. In fact: the United States does not have an official language. By law.

You need to study these things and do a little bit of research before you start spouting off.

That's good to hear, and that's the most important thing.

How generous of you. Are you not seeing the double standard here? 'We' are no more or less entitled to our views than 'you' are. 'Even' has no place in that sentence.

There is a heavy emphasis on evangelism in many forms Christianity. You may not engage in it, and generalizing is never wise, but it's fair for people's perception of the religion to be colored by their experience of its adherents.

There are a lot of Biblical fundamentalists out there, and they are quite prominent in the national debates over social issues. You seem to be confusing global stereotyping with an honest reaction to the beliefs of an increasingly prominent and influential element of the Christian population in the United States. Mike Huckabee would be a good example. He seems reasonable enough, but thinks the Earth is only thousands of years old and that dinosaurs are just fossils put here so we can have gas.

C'mon. The fact that someone who doesn't believe in evolution could have been President scares a lot of people, and that's legitimate.

Maccabee makes some great points here.

1. yea judeo-christian sounds better
2. i don't know anything about a clockmaster god but i was told in church that the Lord's powers are unlimited.
3.no im not going to worship you, what i mean to say is jesus said he was the sun of god in the new testiment but if you read the old testiment that through adam and eve we are all god's children. so even if he wassent a direct son of god, he was still a son of god becase we all are.
4.it dosen't matter who studies what. None of us where there so really we are all just guessing and going by things that were passed down from that time.
5. im not mixing up anything, in fact i was trying to put the pieces back for the dude. he said theat the devil looked like a monster with red horns, well in the bible satan is a beautiful angel, i've even seen pictures in church of satan and they never looked liked that. now with dante's infurno, i was saying that he might of got that image form that book because Dante was one of the first to create a monstorus image of the fallen angel.
6.it says right in the bible that things lived befor adam and eve. he made everything befor he created adam, so how could ppl not believe that?
7. yes, it wouldnt matter to me what was the main religion , as long as they gave me the freedom to practice my own aswell.
8. the revolutionary generation wanted the freedom to practice their own religion, as the pilgrims befor them. but this country was built on the belief in god and the right to be free. hence "in god we trust" and "under god". now im not saying the revolutionary war was like the crusades but a big spark in the hearts of the patriots was the belief in god.
9.no actually your wrong, every country-state has a major language and religion in which they practice. there might be other language and religions in that area, but if you took all the languages and religions and mate a pie graph, you would notice that there would be a language or religion that took up majority of the pie. every place has its own prevailing religion. in fact here is a chart to show you Image:Worldreligion.png - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
10. when i said "even" i wassn't emplying that I have more rights then he does i was tryin to say even someone who is a non believer has the same rights as everyone else.
11. i don't know any christians like that, maybe somewhere up in Idaho somewhere but not here. I understand that there are some real assholes in the world but no matter what the writter when through, he can't say that ALLchristains are bible waving maniacs. obveously be both have some angry passionate views on the topic and thats what always happends when you talk about religion in such a diverse space. He is entitled to his opinion, all im saying is he made a good point until he started ranting about why he dosen't believe that jesus was the sun of god. also i don't think you can debunk religion. and reguardless to what type of scientific statement you make on any religion, there will always be an arguing party. thats all

Love, peace, and hair grease

why do i have to be confused, why can't I just be strait? im not confused about a damn thing. I am saying that there are some ppl who arn't christains or religious at all who think that all christains wanna stuff a bible down your throat. in fact christainty in the states isent getting more prominent its getting less prominent. back in the days, in the U.S. ppl either went to church or they didn't, but if they didn't they still believed in god. but now there are thousands if not millions of ppl in the U.S. who aren't christian. again im not confusing anything i kno exactly whats going on. and that is a common sterotype, and i know a thing or 2 about sterotypes.
P.S. it dosn't matter what the president believes in religiously(keep religion and state seprate) all that matters is if he/she can do a good job running the country. i hope to see a jewish or muslim president one day, that would mean we are braking down racial barriers.

i was, thats the problem lol.

OK. It's still less accurate.

Which means that God could chose to place limits on how the divine interacts with the mundane, placing a heavier responsibility upon man to self govern, honor humanity and lovingly maintain the created world, rather then relying on God to sort it all out.

Tikkun olam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia -- in Judaism, this concept has been behind a big movement towards ecological good works and environmentalism.

Different flavors of Christianity also have different views of God's nature and how God interacts with humanity and the world, and Deism is one of them.

If you're interested in the clockmaker god concept or Deism:
The "clockmaker God:"
Watchmaker analogy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

This is actually the philosophical underpinnings of the Intelligent Design theory, which isn't all that unappealing even to secularists if you drop the nonsense about denying evolution, and allow that the recorders of the Scripture simply might not have been able to perceive much a distinction between thousands of years and anything more.

Deism, more generally:
Deism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

OK, moving on....

Yes, although the understanding that we are all descendants of Adam hasn't kept believers from killing 'heathens' in the name of God, nor has knowledge that other followers of the One God are all (metaphorically) children of Abraham kept zelaots from slaughtering 'infidels' of other sects.

OK, let's never study anything we can't be sure of. Back to the Dark Ages, everyone!

The story of Satan's fall--angels warring in heaven and whatnot-- comes mostly from Paradise Lost, as does the archetype of Lucifer Morningstar which seems to be the conception of the devil you think is 'authoritative.' According to Jewish scripture, Sa'tan was a minor angel and was not particularly important even after his fall from grace. The New Testament focuses on Satan as the generic figure of the Tempter and the Adversary. You seem to be describing the Miltonian expansion upon the Biblical sources which is perfectly normal because Paradise Lost is deeply embedded in the Lutheran tradition and all of the forms of Protestantism that descended from it. There's nothing wrong with that, either! It was written by a deeply religious man for a religious audience.

It says he did it in a matter of days. Literal readers of the Bible take that to mean that everything in the fossil record that pre-dates the time frame given for Creation must have been Created that way for some reason and never have actually lived. Or, that they fossil record is somehow wrong and that man and prehistoric creatures co-existed until the Flood.

I find that hard to swallow, but it's a very nice sentiment. I'll tell you that even as a non-observant Jew, it's a lot harder when the shoe is on the other foot. Things are pretty miserable in the US for Muslims right now, even though their religious rights are protected. Don't underestimate how being part of the rather devout majority can alter your perspective.

That's true. But they wanted God out of politics itself.
I said official, not main. We don't have an official state religion or language.

Languages of the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
English is spoken by ~82% of the US population. A 20% composition of linguistic minorities is significant.

Our religious demographics are even more diverse. And a 'major religion' is hardly a 'state religion.' Some coutries have very narrow religious splits--in a 45/55 split, is the religion with 55% percent the 'main' religion?

Cool. But you just did it again. Don't say 'even'. What's wrong with:
"I was trying to say someone who is a non believer has the same rights as everyone else." That use of 'even' implies that you are 'willing to allow' their participation despite their 'lack.' Well, that's nice...I could say "even religious people have a right to vote." Does that sound very tolerant?

So, now you want to generalize about Christianity in a region not your own...

I'm not trying to defend the article, I'm just trying to get you to examine your own thinking.

I agree completely. Trying to debunk religion misses the point entirely.

Back at'cha.

That's because some/most of them do.
Evangelism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
That's why.

It's fairly similar to the Muslim call to Jihad--which originally meant spiritual warfare in the sense of the struggle to save souls--not necessarily by the sword. So too did Christians abuse the Commission to justify the Crusades.

Anyway, the point is that Christians and Muslims are explicitly commanded to convert non-believers. (Jews are not, trying to convert to Judaism is difficult.)


Actually, religiosity and church attendance is exploding right now. Look at whats going on with Rick Warren & The Purpose Driven Life, Joel Osteen's huge ministry, etc. Pentecostalism is exploding in the United States and abroad.

Do you want me to provide sources? I don't want to be too pedantic. I'm not trying to jump all over your case.

Sadly, most of us do. You're absolutely right that religious people are stereotyped just as harshly as atheists and agnostics.

I don't believe that someone who thinks that science is a myth or an illusion can be a good President. I don't believe that someone who thinks the Constitution should be amended to impose religious morality upon the public can be a good President.

I'll stop there, I think that gets the point across. We've certainly had religious men as President in the past who did a great job.

1. Everything about jesus WAS hearsay NOT one historian of that time even says anything about jesus, why is this? someone who turns water to wine..and NOTHING?
2. Jews don't believe that jesus is (godson)
3. Another thing is The Christian Bible has been changed soo many times how can you believe anything in it?
4. Christians believe the bible word for word jews know its all metaphors

sorry, im jewish thought id throw my 2 cents in.
for all you people who dont beilve in a GOD, YHWH, Yahweh, Yehova whatever you want to call your CREATOR should check out zeitgiest the movie.

keep on burnin