Long ass video, I don't expect a lot of people to watch it all the way through, but I thought I'd post it anyway.
Here's a little window into a few of our lives. This is how these things go 99% of the time. I'll leave you to make your own conclusions. This is why it gets difficult sometimes to keep composed and explain our side of things, it get's left on deaf ears, people like this simply don't want to hear it. Notable atheists like Richard Dawkins and Hitchens when he was still around develop bad reputations and get labeled "militant atheists!" when they decide to themselves "these people are just fucking idiots, there is no longer any point in trying to do this with logic and reason" and come up with new, albeit with a sometimes IDGAF mentality, techniques. Watch this video, even 5 minutes, if you can still blame them after that for their current positions or way they go about things, I'd like to hear why.
So a little background about the clip, here on the left we've got Kent Hovind's little kid, Eric Hovind arguing for the creationists side, if you don't know who Kent Hovind is;
If a dude wants to follow whatever religion, be it Allah, Christ, Buddah, the great spirit, karma, or whatever, I gives a fuck, until their BEHAVIOR threatens me or mine.
NOBODY knows how all this shit got started. PERIOD. Not the "scientists", not the "religionists". Nobody.
Sorry to piss on your anti-creationist thread, but people who demonize other folks choice of beliefs irritate me about as much as those who demonize cannabis.
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Originally Posted by Wilksey
Who gives a flying fuck what ANYBODY "believes"?
I sure as hell don't.
BEHAVIOR is what concerns me, NOT "beliefs".
If a dude wants to follow whatever religion, be it Allah, Christ, Buddah, the great spirit, karma, or whatever, I gives a fuck, until their BEHAVIOR threatens me or mine.
NOBODY knows how all this shit got started. PERIOD. Not the "scientists", not the "religionists". Nobody.
Sorry to piss on your anti-creationist thread, but people who demonize other folks choice of beliefs irritate me about as much as those who demonize cannabis.
Rational criticism does not count as demonization. The lack of critical thought and proper examination is what allows anti-cannabis propaganda to continue influencing policy. These same standards of reasoning and candidness that we strive for in cannabis issues are what atheists apply to theism. Can you think of any good reason why religious beliefs should not be open to doubt? Would it be okay for a physicist or a politician to play the hurt card when his theories or policies are objectively criticized? When we are presented with answers intended to replace our ignorance, is it ever okay to say they should be unquestionably accepted?
I do agree with you about behavior, too bad the creationists don't. A person can believe, preach and celebrate whatever they want so long as their behavior does not intrude. I believe all people should have these basic liberties, however there is nothing I can see that protects the practice of these liberties from skepticism and comment. Much of what creationists believe is deeply offensive to the rest of the world. When you throw in the fact that creationists are actively and aggressively trying to infiltrate science class rooms and thwart the teaching of sound scientific knowledge, skepticism is not only permitted, it is mandatory. Do you consider mis-education of your children a threat? When a belief system entails that the believer evangelize and demand absolute surrender to the idea without any allowance for dissension, isn't it a threat by default?
There is a clear link between behavior and beliefs. We believe a proposition because we trust that it accurately represents a state of reality. From a simple belief like "I tied my shoes this morning" to a complicated belief like those behind chemotherapy, this remains true. Even a superstitious belief, like fear of black cats, follows the mechanism of trusting that it states something about reality. Basic survival demands we be accurate about our reality. Beliefs become principals of action. We rightfully attempt to justify beliefs with some sort of evidence. We seek for them to cohere both logically and comparatively with each other. This is why individuals are able to construct a personal view of the world that largely agrees with others. Even something simple like knowing what I mean when I say words like 'danger', 'upwards', or 'seven' stems from this shared connection. Religious beliefs are not distinct; they are not exempt from this premise, so why should they be exempt from the constraints we apply to all other beliefs?
Last edited by Heisenberg; 04-06-2012 at 02:21 AM.
Somewhere, there is something incredible waiting to be confused for aliens.
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Notice that Thunderfoot is able to dynamically demonstrate his position from different angles and avenues, and the creationist can only double down on the same fallacious talking points and school yard mentality. This is something we have been seeing from creationists for decades. No amount of reasoning has ever penetrated the creationist bubble.
Just as shit always attracts flies, the truth will always be covered in lies - Ventana
Somewhere, there is something incredible waiting to be confused for aliens.
Rational criticism??!?? In this video thunderfoot attempts to spin/deflect the vary things he proposes, within the first 5 min.
Just as shit always attracts flies, the truth will always be covered in lies - Ventana
@ Heisburg:You should apply your own advice about critical thought, and proper examination, if you truly believe these threads initiated on the topic of religion are rational criticism. It seems to me that "DEMONIZATION" is a very appropriate term when describing the intent of most of them.
IMHO, it is possible to use reason and logic to have Faith in something that you can't scientifically prove to exist. That is to say that faith is not entirely unfounded. It is created upon the corner stone of an informed decision, by placing together peices of a puzzle to form a bigger picture.
Faith
noun 1. confidence or trust in a person or thing: faith in another's ability.
2. belief that is not based on proof: He had faith that the hypothesis would be substantiated by fact.
3. belief in God or in the doctrines or teachings of religion: the firm faith of the Pilgrims.
4. belief in anything, as a code of ethics, standards of merit, etc.: to be of the same faith with someone concerning honesty.
5. a system of religious belief: the Christian faith; the Jewish faith.
Does anyone, have all the answers?....No, but we can have enough to make an informed decision.
YOU have FREE WILL to accept, reject or to be indifferent to whatever you choose, we all do....the consequences are of your own choice.
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. LIVE AND LET LIVE.
p.s. I am aware that for the most part, this is probably falling on deaf ears.
WhEn ThE bOwL iS eMpTy FILL It.--------WhEn ThE bOwL iS FULL eMpTy It.
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A Conversation With A Creationist
Originally Posted by Wilksey
It did get exasperating...
----WhEn ThE bOwL iS FULL eMpTy It.
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