This is a carry over from another thread in politics.

JVS is of the opinion that Christ was crucified by the Romans for treason.

I maintain that the Romans crucified Christ for blasphemy at the behest of the Sanhedrin, because of the way Roman rule worked with local governments of its conquered.

To which he replied:

Now that we are all caught up.

Luke 22
70Then said they all, Art thou then the Son of God? And he said unto them, Ye say that I am.
71And they said, What need we any further witness? for we ourselves have heard of his own mouth.

Further witness to what crime? Being the Son of God...

2And they began to accuse him, saying, We found this fellow perverting the nation, and forbidding to give tribute to Caesar, saying that he himself is Christ a King.

Now... not only did Jesus and His disciples pay their taxes... but He never claimed to be an earthly king.

Pilot found no fault with these charges and wanted to let him go. They were trying to find a vested interest in Rome executing Him. It was only under great protest of the crime of blasphemy that he submitted to THEIR LAW.


A brief history of the Roman empire and authority.

How Rome was able to conquer and control so much of the globe was because of a brilliant strategy, which began with war, and ended with taxes. They allowed their conquered people to maintain their own governments, religions, and activities wherever they went, to prevent civil unrest... leaving outposts containing small groups of people who oversaw the ruling bodies.

People were only forced to pay taxes, and not offend Caesar. Outside of that, things ran pretty much as they had before they arrived. They served as executioners and tax collectors... while keeping a watchful eye on the governments to prevent usurping Roman rule. If there were any kind of uprising, troops were brought in and the people were punished HORRIBLY... so pretty much things went smoothly. That is how they were able to rule so many for so long... it was KEY to their strategy.

The notion that it would be embarrassing to allow the religious government follow it's own law is grossly inaccurate. It was completely reversed. They ALWAYS allowed the free exercise of religion, and local tribal rule.

The Jews brought Jesus forth for blasphemy as clearly demonstrated in Acts, on THEIR legal authority... and when Pilot says... I don't understand... they try and gain support by suggesting he preached that taxes should not be payed to rome... which again... the ROMAN authority had no belief in... and had to be convinced that it was simply their way. Remember... this is the birth of the senate... of the belief that a people are best left to govern themselves.

Pilot was against the death of Jesus, but was committed to not interfering in the local religious authorities decision... so at their INSISTENCE he was put to death.

You take king to mean a territorial king... whereas the title was given because of the bloodline of God. It was blasphemy... and doing miracles and whatnot? Demonstrating the power of God?


WIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITCH

BUURRRRN HIMMMMMMMM...



That is simply how Rome handled maintaining foreign authority... by giving much of it away.

"The Roman Empire encompassed a huge amount of territory, but also allowed people of many different cultures to retain their heritage into modern times. The empire helped to perpetuate the art, literature, and philosophy of the Greeks, the religious and ethical system of the Jews, the new religion of the Christians, Babylonian astronomy and astrology, and cultural elements from Persia, Egypt, and other eastern civilizations. The Romans supplied their own peculiar talents for government, law, and architecture and also spread their Latin language. In this way they created the Greco-Roman synthesis, the rich combination of cultural elements that for two millennia has shaped what we call the Western tradition."

http://encarta.msn.com/encyclopedia_...an_empire.html

The charge of "forbidding tribute" was thrown in to try and entice Pilot to rule in their favor.. because it was his ultimate decision... and he believed in a lot of Gods... so he might not understand the offense. His Gods spawned all the time with humans... so they had to make a case because at the end of the day... it was his decision to make.

24And Pilate gave sentence that it should be as they required.


Not as Rome requires, not as Caesar requires, but as the Sanhedrin Priests required.



Just as a point of record, Jesus never claimed to be the Son of God either. He ALWAYS referred to Himself as the son of man.

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i thought jesus was fake
like you saw him on south park

__________________
"When you smoke the Herb,It reveals you to yourself"

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Treason:
1. betrayal of country: a violation of the allegiance owed by somebody to his or her own country, e.g. by aiding an enemy.

Blasphemy:
1. a : the act of insulting or showing contempt or lack of reverence for God b : the act of claiming the attributes of deity.


Pilot clearly demonstrates that Christ did not offend Rome.

Pilot clearly does not see any offense warranting death.

Pilot is clearly just keeping the peace by letting the civil authority have its way.


I mean... if you believe the bible, and know ANYTHING about the Roman empire...


The only treason he committed, was blasphemy to a religious authority.



The original statement which spawned this...

So you guys stop cramming this shit down peoples throats, and stop being so easily offended. Nothing good comes of it. Nothing.

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i shouldent post on this thread as im athiest
sooo sorry for my stupidity towards jesus...

__________________
"When you smoke the Herb,It reveals you to yourself"

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People believe in the Bible??? Wow. You realize it's a work of fiction, right?

Your post was tl;dr... why am I posting here?

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Why people believe strange things: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8T_jw...eature=channel

jesus was crucified for being one cool motha fucka by some haters. jesus was the kinda cat you go to the club with buy out the bar and he pays the tab, then put one to the sky of some danky

The validity of the bible/existence of God have absolutely fuck all to do with this discussion.



You can discuss Battlefield Earth without believing it is TRUE... unless you are John Travolta.

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the reason jesus was crucified was blasphemy.
the official charge before the state however is another matter.

to blaspheme judaism was not a violation of roman law. to avoid causing a
piss-storm with a generally antisemetic-yet-tolerant state, jesus' declaration
that he was "king of the jews" was exploited as grounds for a charge of high
treason.

jerusalem was roman territory and rome could simply carry out a
punishment which suits those who challenge the throne. since the law
did not recognise 'king' in a strictly spiritual sense, the charge was convenient.
not only that but rome didnt have to go through the embarrassment of enforcing
law based upon hebrew scripture.

its a common practice in law: finding a charge that sticks and doesn't ruffle the wrong feathers.
think back to al capone. jailed for being a sociopathic murderer but on the charge of tax evasion.

if jeruselum truly followed its own law, and were their own executioners, why did they need pilate's
official consent? why even bother to sugar-coating and repackaging it for pilate? the threat of widespread
civil unreast was quite enough reason to let them have their way. the hebrew clergy had ALL the bargaining leverage in that deal.

pilate simply asked jesus to renounce his self proclaimed kingship, jesus refused, pilate washed his hands, etc etc

Hehe, yeah, Jesus was just a regular guy that knew what was going on. He was considered a conspiracy theorist, blasphemer, traitor etc..just for telling people what was really going on.

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"I get bummed when I run out of weed. Marijuana cures that." ~ Ron White

LMAO! I'm with you on the blasphemy thing too!