much appreciated BROseph, you know, you've been the most courteous to me since i've joined man, you seem like a cool guy, too bad we never met, haha. any way thnx fer the tip man.

lol not the first time ive heard that dude. but hey man.. i'd like to meet a lot of people on here. but when it comes down to it... its pretty sketchy . but who knows.. might meet up one of these days

__________________
"The Cruelest Trick Came From The Talibans, Who Allowed Plenty Of Drugs And Then Banned Music."
"Rarely is the question asked: is our children learning"- G.W.B.

help I'm trying to post myself and can't figure it out

this is a good point, only thing is jesus and his apostles didnt kill in the name of god, and plus we can google anything, we have vast amounts of resources now, as apposed to then when paper was a rarity and used by scholors and in empires, not common citizens, plus if the bible IS accurate, then only two witnessed christ arise, who'd believe them? no one, in fact the romans believed it to be grave robbers.

I do not believe a god exists or ever has.

A couple reasons

How many gods are there? Not everyone can be right.
In modern society, we have many sciences. Many of which can prove Religious stories wrong.
For example in the Bible, I believe when Moses is around, The red sea thing. Scientists have come up with explanations to many stories.

I believe religion has it ups and downs.
People have been killed over Religion. People have seem their ways through Religion. People have used Religion.
Cities have probably fallen and risen over Religion.

For as long as human's have been on the earth, We've wanted to find an understanding to life. Like English glass 5W's (What,When,Who,Where,Why) and of course How. I don't any of those questions will ever be answered.

In the end I dont believe in anything ( There is a word for that but just sounds like a new religion of not believing to me :P)
I'm neutral I guess. If you believe go ahead, If you don't go ahead. Pretty much I don't care.
I could argue the goods and bad all day, but in the end who is right?
Whoever thinks they are.

Btw. I am baptized,did communion,and reconciliation. I have been to church many times as a kid. My family is catholic I'd guess. My grandma still goes to church as often as she can. But after what I have learned over time, I just can't believe in one god/religion.

Check this out, you guys may find it interesting

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAIpRRZvnJg

__________________
Let me slip out of consciousness and into something a little more comfortable...

this is a good point, only thing is jesus and his apostles didnt kill in the name of god, and plus we can google anything, we have vast amounts of resources now, as opposed to then when paper was a rarity and used by scholors and in empires, not common citizens, plus if the bible IS accurate, then only two witnessed christ arise, who'd believe them? no one, in fact the romans believed it to be grave robbers.

you should watch this docu. (this is just a clip couldnt find the whole thing)
but if you go to this vids page on youtube, it gives an impressive description on the leading sceptic scientist who was dead set on disproving the shroud of turins authenticity, then before he died, flipped and after further examining says it very well could be the shroud for the historic jesus.

and also watch this video, its a little old and some of the skepticism of the cloth switching i can is explained in part two of the vid above, based of these vids, tell me how its fake, or debatable.

trust me, you probably wont say anything i havent heard or already debunked.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8KLjxFCpXw

this aught to be good. i love debates.

Pieces of the shroud that were originally taken for carbon dating were not entirely destroyed in the process. The bulk remains in cold storage and there is currently a movement to have them re-tested with the most modern equipment. Carbon dating has come a long way since them, but in terms of detailed accuracy. Over 5 independent labs tested the samples, the consensus was it was from the middle ages, and thus a forgery. For all the independent labs to be off by more than a thousand years and yet give highly overlapping dates... it would be an astronomical coincidence that such a thing could occur.

__________________
Let me slip out of consciousness and into something a little more comfortable...

they HAVE retested and it was a docu on discovery channel, they piece they took from the older documentary is actually from whenever it was almost destroyed by fire, and the wove together new tapestry when the templar knights were holding it. so the pieces they snipped from the corners WERE from middle ages, how ever recent examination shows that there is newer (middle ages) fabric woven with the original cloth to give it back its full shape to the shroud.