Was Jesus for war? Can followers of Jesus also be war supporters?

7x sez ...

"the truth is, humans are spiritual beings in a physical body. we live in a physical world that we can touch and see but the spiritual remains apart from our perception most of the time. sometimes we catch a glimpse but most people brush it aside. when our faith is weak we rely on the effect we can have on the physical world, with results that we can count and display. our need for validation holds us prisoner to our physically tethered ego. this is why Christians have war, for a split second we forget the magnificence and power that we are part of and we act apart from it, we act without faith."

Excellent! If only the majority of people understood what you wrote above, the world would be a much better place.

Vi

Originally Posted by 7xstall

it is not an easy task to love people who kill thousands of innocent people, as Bush and Bin Laden have but that's what we're told to do.






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I had no idea that bush killed anybody? Nor do I have any evidence that bin laden killed anybody...

Maybe airplane manufactures and the wright brothers should also be blamed for 9-11.. And maybe the people who were on the plane should be blamed... since it was THEIR desire that put them on that plane... maybe it is the people who built the TRADE CENTER who should be blamed..

maybe this is all Adams fault for shagging EVE..... there is never an end to the blame game.. there is never a solution in the blame game.. there is NEVER truth in the blame game...

iloveyou

Originally Posted by 7xstall

the truth is, humans are spiritual beings in a physical body. we live in a physical world that we can touch and see but the spiritual remains apart from our perception most of the time. sometimes we catch a glimpse but most people brush it aside. when our faith is weak we rely on the effect we can have on the physical world, with results that we can count and display. our need for validation holds us prisoner to our physically tethered ego. this is why Christians have war, for a split second we forget the magnificence and power that we are part of and we act apart from it, we act without faith.

the other side is that there is evil in the world. there are people who enjoy killing and murdering. islam is made out of lust for destruction and Death. some of those people are reprobate and resigned to eternity apart from God - they embrace the prospect of hell because they think they will get the best room when they arrive there - no one would rightfully expect the Almighty God to have to entertain them with 72 virgins once they are in His presence! they KNOW they are not going to be with God for eternity. that makes it impossible to reach them with our love so there is no reason to allow them to cause us harm. there is no reason to allow them to cut another's life short.






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nobody enjoys killing and murdering...

there is no difference between the spiritual and the physical realms... it is just ONE realm.... it is all HERE... NOW...

The distinction between the spiritual and the physical is an illusion....

as you mentioned "for a split second we forget the magnificence and power that we are part of and we act apart from it, we act without faith".


most people NEVER KNOW.... they only believe... and believing in god is the same as killing your neighbor... IT is one's belief that seprates them from KNOWING an unknowable GOD.. there is nothing to believe... there is only LIFE

iloveyou

Originally Posted by medicineman

What happened to love thine enemies, or turn the other cheek. I believe Jesus was the epitome of anti-war. Jesus came to forgive and change the premise of the old testament, an eye for an eye bullshit.

the words say peace, but there is always that underlying disgust for all that is other. keep in mind that all who do not believe as the chosen do are damned for all eternity, the believers never forget it. this is the ultimate example of the ultimate hate. it's not just a matter of "believe as i do or i'll kill you", this is a hatred that spans all time. cloaked in words of love, the faithful see all others as undeserving of paradise and doomed to the pit forever. where is the love in that?

Originally Posted by 7xstall

islam is made out of lust for destruction and Death. some of those people are reprobate and resigned to eternity apart from God - they embrace the prospect of hell because they think they will get the best room when they arrive there - no one would rightfully expect the Almighty God to have to entertain them with 72 virgins once they are in His presence! they KNOW they are not going to be with God for eternity. that makes it impossible to reach....

you've just given me the perfect example. from you post i take you for a christian and here you are damning an entire group for the actions of the few who have chosen to base their faith on the worst instructions from their sacred writings. members of all religions choose those parts of scripture which they will take to heart, usually based on personal preference or the demands of their particular sect. there are muslims who espouse the tenets of peace to be found within the qur'an and yet you damn them all in one fell swoop. not only are they damned, but you see them as evil incarnate and incapable of redemption without accepting your view of eternity. is this an example of the love and forgiveness christians are so famous for?

Originally Posted by undertheice

you've just given me the perfect example. from you post i take youfor a christian and here you are damning an entire group for theactions of the few who have chosen to base their faith on the worstinstructions from their sacred writings. members of all religionschoose those parts of scripture which they will take to heart, usuallybased on personal preference or the demands of their particular sect.there are muslims who espouse the tenets of peace to be found withinthe qur'an and yet you damn them all in one fell swoop. not only arethey damned, but you see them as evil incarnate and incapable ofredemption without accepting your view of eternity. is this an exampleof the love and forgiveness christians are so famous for?

you need to understand that i don't damn them, they damn themselves and i owe it to them to be honest about this. acceptance is available to everyone who choses it, i'm not better than them or you or anyone else. however, many of those people are reprobate, they have closed their heart to the point that no light may enter, they are just passing time here on earth before passing to hell. other muslims are not so hardened and i didn't say they are all "evil incarnate".



islam is a political system built on violence and death, plain and simple. i made athread about it and if you want to contribute something to that discussion please do. exposing islam isn't relevant to the current thread and i was just using the extremists as an example of when spiritual things can be out of our hands. a man can give up his soul while he's still alive and the body that lives on is like an animal with no conscience and no hope for salvation. there is no reasoning with them. there is no love that will appeal to them, death is their only joy.



Freedom of Religion - Freedom of Hate












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Originally Posted by Garden Knowm

I had no idea that bush killed anybody? Nor do I have any evidence that bin laden killed anybody...

Maybe airplane manufactures and the wright brothers should also be blamed for 9-11.. And maybe the people who were on the plane should be blamed... since it was THEIR desire that put them on that plane... maybe it is the people who built the TRADE CENTER who should be blamed..

maybe this is all Adams fault for shagging EVE..... there is never an end to the blame game.. there is never a solution in the blame game.. there is NEVER truth in the blame game...

iloveyou

Christians are commanded to love, with no conditions. that's what i meant. we can't make excuses about how terrible people are or how mean they are or any of that.






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Originally Posted by undertheice

the words say peace, but there is always that underlying disgust for all that is other. keep in mind that all who do not believe as the chosen do are damned for all eternity, the believers never forget it. this is the ultimate example of the ultimate hate. it's not just a matter of "believe as i do or i'll kill you", this is a hatred that spans all time. cloaked in words of love, the faithful see all others as undeserving of paradise and doomed to the pit forever. where is the love in that?

That is not what christianity is about at all. The men who say they are christians, perhaps. But not the religion itself. Jesus told us to love and accept all and let he who is without sin cast the first stone. You should really read the bible before you going talking that nonsense. The overall message of the New Testament is to love everyone and not to judge other people, it is all about peace and not war. A true Christian would not have 'an underlying disgust for all that is other.'

Originally Posted by Garden Knowm

nobody enjoys killing and murdering...

there is no difference between the spiritual and the physical realms... it is just ONE realm.... it is all HERE... NOW...

The distinction between the spiritual and the physical is an illusion....

as you mentioned "for a split second we forget the magnificence and power that we are part of and we act apart from it, we act without faith".


most people NEVER KNOW.... they only believe... and believing in god is the same as killing your neighbor... IT is one's belief that seprates them from KNOWING an unknowable GOD.. there is nothing to believe... there is only LIFE

iloveyou

i agree, the spiritual and physical is in one "envelope" but it takes a different awareness to experience the spiritual aspects.

knowing is the goal but it takes faith to know anything. the knowledge that comes will confirm the faith that sought it. right?






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