In case you forgot

medicineman · #1 11-30-2006, 05:43 PM

The Constitution of the United States of America

We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, provide for the common defense, promote the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America. seems to me, the general welfare would include medical care, establishing justice would mean no one would be treated less than another

ViRedd · #2 12-01-2006, 12:57 PM

Evidently you weren't aware that the Founders thought every word through very carefully before you posted that, Med. You've made a very common error, or intentional oversight, that supporters of a large intrusive government continue to make. Let me parse the words a little differently, Med:

"We the people of the United States, in order to form a more perfect union, establish justice, insure domestic tranquility, PROVIDE for the common defense, PROMOTE the general welfare, and secure the blessings of liberty to ourselves and our posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

So there you have it, Med. The Founders, in their wisdom, wanted the federal government to PROMOTE the general welfare and PROVIDE for the common defense.

That's why I continually post that the legitimate function of the federal goverment is to PROVIDE for the defense of the rights of the citizens.

And how can the federal government best PROMOTE the general welfare of the citizens? By staying the hell out of the citizens affairs.

Oh, and by the way, that would include promoting the preservation of our financial privacy too, which is exactly why the founders called for taxes to be collected via tariffs, duties and excise taxes. Did you notice in your study of the document that they didn't mention a tax on income?

One final thought ... do you, or do you not, agree that there is a difference between the words PROVIDE and PROMOTE?

Vi

medicineman · #3 12-01-2006, 02:28 PM

One final thought ... do you, or do you not, agree that there is a difference between the words PROVIDE and PROMOTE?
Provide:to make a proviso or stipulation; to take measures beforehand;to supply what is needed;to supply for use. promote: to contribute to the growth or prosperity of: further; launch! Id say provide is to supply and promote is to get started; contribute is the key word here. If the feds contributed to health care or launched it and then contributed to it, then promoting would be applicable. You see it is a simple matter of semantics and how one views them. I say that Health care is a right not a priveledge and you say opposite. We'll never agree on this: From your point of view, if you can't afford an operation, just die. You should read my scrooge post, I think it fits your view on life!

ViRedd · #4 12-02-2006, 04:32 PM

One final thought ... do you, or do you not, agree that there is a difference between the words PROVIDE and PROMOTE?
Provide:to make a proviso or stipulation; to take measures beforehand;to supply what is needed;to supply for use. promote: to contribute to the growth or prosperity of: further; launch!

Id say provide is to supply and promote is to get started; contribute is the key word here. If the feds contributed to health care or launched it and then contributed to it, then promoting would be applicable. You see it is a simple matter of semantics and how one views them. I say that Health care is a right not a priveledge and you say opposite. We'll never agree on this: From your point of view, if you can't afford an operation, just die. You should read my scrooge post, I think it fits your view on life!

So, in YOUR Constitution, it says: The Congress has the power to "Launch" and to "Contribute?" *lol* ... You are a riot in every post, Med. Funny stuff, guy.

Vi

medicineman · #5 12-02-2006, 09:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ViRedd

One final thought ... do you, or do you not, agree that there is a difference between the words PROVIDE and PROMOTE?
Provide:to make a proviso or stipulation; to take measures beforehand;to supply what is needed;to supply for use. promote: to contribute to the growth or prosperity of: further; launch!

Id say provide is to supply and promote is to get started; contribute is the key word here. If the feds contributed to health care or launched it and then contributed to it, then promoting would be applicable. You see it is a simple matter of semantics and how one views them. I say that Health care is a right not a priveledge and you say opposite. We'll never agree on this: From your point of view, if you can't afford an operation, just die. You should read my scrooge post, I think it fits your view on life!

So, in YOUR Constitution, it says: The Congress has the power to "Launch" and to "Contribute?" *lol* ... You are a riot in every post, Med. Funny stuff, guy.

Vi

Glad I could entertain you but if you read what I said, you could interpret it that way. I took the definitions of the two words from Merriam Webster, so it depends on how you interpret it, sort of like all you Christian geeks interpret the Bible to suit your thesis', you'll look through every passage in the Bible untill you find one that says what you need to make your point, just like a pentecostal preacher. I believe this is how you do your thinking. provide an Idea then go looking everywhere to find crap that will back it up even if it has nothing to do with the original Idea! As In, Heres the proof, and it's just more crap!

Tokahontas · #6 12-02-2006, 09:07 PM

Wow, you two act like brothers! Or rival candidates. I cant decide.

ViRedd · #7 12-03-2006, 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by medicineman

Glad I could entertain you but if you read what I said, you could interpret it that way. I took the definitions of the two words from Merriam Webster, so it depends on how you interpret it, sort of like all you Christian geeks interpret the Bible to suit your thesis', you'll look through every passage in the Bible untill you find one that says what you need to make your point, just like a pentecostal preacher. I believe this is how you do your thinking. provide an Idea then go looking everywhere to find crap that will back it up even if it has nothing to do with the original Idea! As In, Heres the proof, and it's just more crap!

Off topic again, Med. Obfucation is NOT winning a debate ... it is nothing more than spin.

Now then, do you still see the words "Congress Shall Promote The General Welfare In Order To Provide It" in the Constitution? Or have I finally convinced you otherwise? *lol*

Vi

medicineman · #8 12-03-2006, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ViRedd

Off topic again, Med. Obfucation is NOT winning a debate ... it is nothing more than spin.

Now then, do you still see the words "Congress Shall Promote The General Welfare In Order To Provide It" in the Constitution? Or have I finally convinced you otherwise? *lol*

Vi

Actually you have not convinced me, It doesn't demand you provide but it suggests you provide, so in that duel of semantics if you need force to make it happen then it doesn't force the issue, but it leaves the door open for intelligent people to make up their minds about such things and act on them! Greater minds than ours will make that decision!

ViRedd · #9 12-03-2006, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by medicineman

Actually you have not convinced me, It doesn't demand you provide but it suggests you provide, so in that duel of semantics if you need force to make it happen then it doesn't force the issue, but it leaves the door open for intelligent people to make up their minds about such things and act on them! Greater minds than ours will make that decision!

Right-ta-ta, Med. And that which Moses brought down from Mt. Sinai were The Ten Suggestions. *lol*

Vi