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  #21    
Old 10-23-2009, 07:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tusseltussel View Post
im a hard core active democrate i own 5 guns noone will ever take my guns. now i dnt see any reason for anyone to own an assault riffle and i belive there should be restrictions in highly populated area's in the cities but i love my guns and noone is evan trying to take em away. guns gays and baby killers thats all they got on dems, i like my guns so do millions of other dems, i dnt care about gays gettn married dnt bother me shouldnt bother you, i dnt kill babies i am pro choice. good day
Agreed 100%
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  #22    
Old 10-23-2009, 07:55 AM
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i say everyone should have at least one.
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  #23    
Old 10-23-2009, 07:57 AM
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I need nukes and anthrax to protect my rights... why can you have your weapons but I can't have mine?
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  #24    
Old 10-23-2009, 08:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Roy View Post
There is no HUGE difference if my failing to participate does not cause another harm is there? The ONLY difference then would be a group of people calling themselves government wouldn't get to own my behavior or unjustly punish me for believing I own myself.

Laws are not inherently just or moral and quite often are flat out wrong. For instance slavery was once legal, but I would never have told a slave, "just be a good slave and some day this will be illegal and you can be free" or "hey slave work on changing the law" .

Simply offering "it's the law" as a justification for a stupid law is a circular argument. Obviously murder and harming people should have consequences. Should there be consequences to people that break stupid laws, but harm nobody?

Do you follow all stupid laws? That would be endorsing stupid behavior wouldn't it?
I'm not saying that all laws are just, and there are a number of laws I don't agree with. Regardless of whether I agree with them or not, I realize that if I break those laws I am subject to punishment for my "crimes".

I guess it depends on your definition of "harm". NoDrama just gave a pretty good example of what happens when there is very little or no regulatory control over a particular group of individuals. (BTW NoDrama, they "sat on their hands and did nothing" over at the SEC because there has been an increasing number of DEregulatory measures imposed upon the financial sector over the past decade or two. They WERE doing their job by NOT regulating certain areas, because that's what they were told to do). I say you are causing harm to everyone when you don't "participate" in the nonvoluntary action of paying taxes.

By not paying taxes, you are ADDING to the financial burdens of everyone who does. If there isn't enough tax revenue coming in to pay for the things we use, what happens? Other people have to pay more, don't they? Who do you think pays more in taxes, businesses or individuals? If you guessed businesses, you're right. What happens when extra taxes are imposed on businesses? If you said, small businesses suffer the most and lots of people lose their jobs, you're right again! What happens when lots of people are unemployed? Demand for government services goes UP. If people aren't paying taxes, where does the money come from to pay for these services? What's that? You say you want to get rid of these services? And there's no HARM in that?

Do you see where I'm going with this?

We seem to have a fundamental disagreement between us over the concept of "liberty". "Every man for himself" is not a system of government, it's a declaration of a desire for non-government. You seem to think you'd have more "liberty" if there were no government, but I think there's empirical evidence to suggest otherwise. Without our government, there is no "liberty". Not for you, not for me, not for any of us. There was a time, not so long ago, when wars were fought on American soil. Do you remember what they were fighting for? Independence, right? Do you really want to go back to the days when every militarized nation with enough strength was camped out on what is now US soil hoping to claim America for themselves?
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  #25    
Old 10-23-2009, 08:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob Roy View Post
Idiot showing up at a healthcare rally with a gun? If you mean Portsmouth NH..He's not an idiot, I know him, he's a pretty smart guy. He believes in liberty, for everybody. I might not have done what he did, but that doesn't make him stupid.

The irony is this person with a gun was protesting peacefully. He doesn't want to particpate in government administered healthcare. He doesn't believe he or you for that matter, should be forced to participate.

What will happen if he doesn't pay the fine for nonparticipation and excercising free will ? Your beloved GOVERNMENT MEN WITH GUNS will show up at his house to MAKE him pay or suffer consequences....ironic huh?

He's is advocating for freedom and choice and has a gun to protect those rights. Your boys have guns to TAKE those rights away.

That's funny. The guy with the gun has no idea what's going on, and neither do you.

Who is trying to FORCE anyone to participate in "government run health care"? How old is this dude? Does he plan on participating in Medicare, I wonder?

Yes, the senate finance bill included an individual mandate to buy health insurance - but there is a CHOICE between the "public option" and private insurance. If he wants to CHOOSE private insurance, he is free to do so. If he can't afford either, he can get an exemption from the mandate meaning he would NOT be required to purchase any health insurance.

It's still up in the air as to whether or not the final bill will include a mandate of any kind, and could possibly include a provision allowing individual states to OPT OUT of the entire program if they so CHOOSE.
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  #26    
Old 10-23-2009, 08:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BloodShot420 View Post
I'm a stoner, and a grower... I'm a peaceful hippie

but if you try to fuck with me - I always got my 9... always

i voted for Obama... but he's an idiot about guns ... (unless he's trying to stimulate the economy by threatening to take them away... gun sales are ridiculous, close to double average). IMO his view of guns is not bad enough to lose my vote... i think his gun stance just reflects how badly he wants peace... just misdirected.

i dont know who said it but "if you outlaw all the guns, only the outlaws have guns"...
still waiting for an answer! wait whats that he didn't threatn to take your guns hmmmmmm. this is one of those lies that keeps on goin democrates dnt want to take your guns a lot of them own guns themselves but when you hear democrate you automatically think oh noo they are gonna take my guns,,, true story i was sittn at a local diner when oboma was first elected and overheard the man in the booth behind me telling his son "that obama is gonna take all our guns and put us to work in the cotton fields to get back at us, us being whitey. now this guy was totally serious its really sickening that ppl will teach there children such hate and that they themselves believe it as true, i find that most ppl draw their own conclusions and than spread that missinformation as truth. sad sad world. srry kinda got off topic there

Quote:
Originally Posted by londonfog View Post
ummm when did Obama say he was going to take your gun ?????
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  #27    
Old 10-23-2009, 01:46 PM
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an armed society is a polite society


if every sane person had a gun in their car at all times, carjackings would plummet


if every home owner had a gun, with a sign stating they did, burglary would plummit


if you could walk down the street with your gun on your hip, muggings, rapes, and robberies would also fall like obamas approval rating


of course, in the first few days of these laws (if they actually happened)

there would be a lot of shootings as all of the morons and idiots weeded eachother out
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  #28    
Old 10-23-2009, 01:58 PM
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Am I free to tell them to pack sand?
I have insurance, but what if I don't want it?
They going to force the Amish to buy it?
The Amish don't believe in insurance.
You gonna fine them?
you gonna kick in their doors?
You gonna put them in jail?
If not why do they get special privledges?

Government mandates don't work
In states that mandate auto insurance 15% don't have it.
People that don't have H.I. probably can't afford it.
So we are going to force them to choose between feeding their kids
and buying insurance or going on the government dole.

I know its hard to break the habits of a lifetime.
Breaking the conditioning given you in school.
But governments job is just this:
Protect the people from theft, fraud and violence.
Thats it.

But when the government engages in fraud what are we to do?
When the government becomes the enforcement arm of the insurance companies and banks.
What do we do?

So I reject the initiation of violence
except in the defence of peaceful people of this country.
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  #29    
Old 10-23-2009, 02:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tusseltussel View Post
im a hard core active democrate i own 5 guns noone will ever take my guns. now i dnt see any reason for anyone to own an assault riffle and i belive there should be restrictions in highly populated area's in the cities but i love my guns and noone is evan trying to take em away. guns gays and baby killers thats all they got on dems, i like my guns so do millions of other dems, i dnt care about gays gettn married dnt bother me shouldnt bother you, i dnt kill babies i am pro choice. good day
You own 5 guns and don't see the logic in having an assault Rifle? Umm assault rifles are easier to handle , can have a higher rate of fire and are purpose made for shooting government agents and black booted thugs dead! The greatest reason for owning a firearm is to protect oneself from government tyranny!! I like to poke holes in paper targets and in 2 weeks I'm gonna go poke one in a doe eyed leaf eatin' deer. Then Im going to disembowel the corpse, throw it on the hood of my truck and drive through town hollerin' out the window like the rednecks do. After that I will hang it in my Garage and go to town on it with a saw and knife. Some of it I will take to a processor to have them make sausage and jerky and the rest will be Venison steaks for the deep freeze. So many uses for a gun, why would anyone want to get rid of them?
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  #30    
Old 10-23-2009, 03:33 PM
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