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  #21    
Old 07-01-2009, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by jfgordon1 View Post
Disagree. Obama is a brilliant man. he indeed knows he's doing wrong. The elite own him.. he does what they say. if not, he'll end up like Kennedy. plain and simple.
No he doesn't. He's the one that was boasting about never befriending any one that would challenge his socialist ideals. He's a dumb ass.
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  #22    
Old 07-01-2009, 02:49 PM
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No he doesn't. He's the one that was boasting about never befriending any one that would challenge his socialist ideals. He's a dumb ass.
how about this... He knows he's doing wrong, but he doesn't care. He's wants best for him, not the people.?
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  #23    
Old 07-01-2009, 02:51 PM
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how about this... He knows he's doing wrong, but he doesn't care. He's wants best for him, not the people.?
Yeah, that probably explains it a lot better.
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  #24    
Old 07-01-2009, 03:02 PM
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Umm, okay, since when is this new and since when is it something Obama did? The Patriot Act was signed by George W. Bush, not Barack Obama. We are already holding people who haven't been charged with ANY crime. Hello, Guantanamo Bay, anyone? Not all of those prisoners are actual terrorists, and not all of them have been criminally charged! So, essentially, these are "innocent" people who may not have done anything wrong at all, yet we're holding them in prison "indefinitely" (which really means, "until we can come up with something to charge them with".

Going to prison without having been convicted of a crime is also not new. Plenty of innocent people are held without bail, pending trial. There really is no "innocent until proven guilty" in our justice system. It's guilty until proven innocent, or until you pay off someone with sufficient power to get you out of jail.
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Old 07-01-2009, 03:19 PM
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Umm, okay, since when is this new and since when is it something Obama did? The Patriot Act was signed by George W. Bush, not Barack Obama. We are already holding people who haven't been charged with ANY crime. Hello, Guantanamo Bay, anyone? Not all of those prisoners are actual terrorists, and not all of them have been criminally charged! So, essentially, these are "innocent" people who may not have done anything wrong at all, yet we're holding them in prison "indefinitely" (which really means, "until we can come up with something to charge them with".

Going to prison without having been convicted of a crime is also not new. Plenty of innocent people are held without bail, pending trial. There really is no "innocent until proven guilty" in our justice system. It's guilty until proven innocent, or until you pay off someone with sufficient power to get you out of jail.
Bush was aweful, don't get me wrong. however, i don't see obama trying to repeal the Patriot Act. Why would he want to take his own powers away?

here's a couple of his upcoming ideas...



^ "mandatory volunteerism"



^ "prolonged Detention"

Damn Fascist
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  #26    
Old 07-01-2009, 05:45 PM
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Why doesn't Obama repeal the Patriot Act? Well, because he can't. He's in the executive branch of the government, not the legislative branch. He can veto a bill that comes across his desk for a signature, but he can't repeal a law.

He could issue an executive order, but that would be crazy. The republicans and right-wing conspiracy theorists are already all over his ass. Can you imagine what they'd say if he shot down the Patriot Act? As far as most ring-wingers are concerned, Obama is a muslim, terrorist-loving reincarnation of Satan himself. Even though most Americans agree the Patriot Act is possibly the biggest F U to the US Constitution we've ever seen, there'd no doubt be some huge uprising if it was done away with and Obama would be touted as an "Anti-Patriot".
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  #27    
Old 07-02-2009, 03:54 AM
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Is the Patriot Act permanent or does it have a sunset time-line?
It needs to be amended with a sunset provision if not.
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  #28    
Old 07-02-2009, 10:15 AM
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The original text did include sunset provisions. I believe the act was supposed to expire in 2005, but Congress voted to make the act permanent (at least that's my understanding, anyway).
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  #29    
Old 07-02-2009, 11:15 AM
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I'm a little ticked off at Obama and his "prolonged detention", his lack of concern about rendition and Bagrahm prison, his lack of enthusiasm for getting rid of the Patriot act etc., But I think we have a better chance of changing things under Obama than we'd of had under McCain. It is the congress that needs to address these things, and they are deathly afraid of the right wing hacks, the war machine.
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  #30    
Old 07-02-2009, 11:29 AM
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I'm a little ticked off at Obama and his "prolonged detention", his lack of concern about rendition and Bagrahm prison, his lack of enthusiasm for getting rid of the Patriot act etc., But I think we have a better chance of changing things under Obama than we'd of had under McCain. It is the congress that needs to address these things, and they are deathly afraid of the right wing hacks, the war machine.
Exactly! It's CONGRESS, not the President, who makes the laws. Granted, the President can try to influence the Congress's decision and he can veto a bill that passes through Congress - but he can't make laws and he can't repeal laws.

Everyone gets all up in arms when the president says "we should do things this way", like what he says is somehow written into stone. ANYTHING the president "proposes" still has to go through Congress to become a law. Every president has his own "policies" and beliefs on how things should be done. That doesn't mean Congress is going to do those things, or create any laws based on his policies.

Prime example, Obama's so-called "policy" on medical marijuana busts by the DEA. Is this a law? Nope, not even close. I'm fairly sure there is no legislation being introduced to address this policy and MAKE it law, either.

Same thing with Obama's health care plan. Just because he's calling for reform, doesn't mean it's going to happen.
 

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