OHO (organic hash oil)

I noticed the same thing about the dry sift rosin. It looked waxy which equals terps. When I make BHO its either budder or honeycomb/crumble/wax. No more than 130F degrees and tasty as fuck!

researching said:

I am skeptical of the organic claim. Alcohol is distilled. Distilling is condensation and separation of items in a liquid. Yielding a pure product. From my research organic and non organic alcohol are no different, other than the fact you can feel better about the way one was created or what it came from. I see it as a marketing ploy more than anything. Which I'm sure a lot of people would be fine buying because of the organic label.

What would be interesting, but I believe I already know what the outcome would be, would be to do a side by side lab analysis of this "method" using non organic and organic alcohol to measure what if any differences exist. I doubt any other than the "feel good" about using organic instead of non organic effect.

In a way, akin to the marketing term of "natural" as it applies to food labeling.

So as it seems to be, you are just washing/dewaxing a product with ethanol that was made with "organic" ingredients. Nothing new, just with a different label.

Almost like if I were baking banana bread but the only difference is I used two different brands of butter. One being hand churned, and one being machine churned. And lets say I was going to sell them at a bake sale. If I labeled one of them saying made with "hand churned" butter and no label on the other, and placed them side by side which one do you think would outsell the other? Identical taste, nutritional value etc... Hand churned would win hands down. And I could probably sell it for more too.

Essentially it's all PERCEPTION.

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I have to agree with you even though I don't want to. At least when it comes to comparing 99% iso to grain alcohol and 200 proof organic ethyl.

I don't like using the grain alcohol due to the high water content unless it is only for winterizing an iso oil. This is referring to using 192 proof polish vodka. The product came out great, just a pain due to the water.

As for the 200 proof organic ethyl. It does a more dirty extraction compared to 99% iso. This may be good, but it may be bad.

You are right, it does just give me a sense of confidence for long term use when using the organic alcohol. Less concern about harming myself or my patients. This is referring to years of use. My patients and I have used 99% iso oil for over 5 years daily with no problems, but what about 15 or 20 years. Just makes me feel more safe that it is all organic. It does make me more proud to speak of my product being all organic also. Realistically, I don't think it makes a difference as long as it is being made correctly.

As for 99% iso, I must admit, it has produced the more pretty oil I have ever made, but I can't say it was any better other than the looks and easy to work with.

My biggest complaint with the 99% iso and other solvents is the stink. I don't want to be breathing that stuff, I know it is bad to do so. It is a lot more fumy than 200 proof ethyl. I feel a lot more safe using the 200 proof ethyl for the indoor purge just with a fan and no heat. It does not stink up the house. I feel that it is far less explosive and far less dangerous when it comes to inhaling the fumes.

In my opinion when it comes to the solvent being organic, like 200 proof ethyl. It is mostly because it is more safe making the product vs. the safety of ingesting it.

I am kind of an organic freak. However, if it were an emergency and I needed to make a large quantity of oil, I would not hesitate to use 99% iso and the rice cooker method. Especially for a short term, 1 to 5 year use.

researching said:

I noticed the same thing about the dry sift rosin. It looked waxy which equals terps. When I make BHO its either budder or honeycomb/crumble/wax. No more than 130F degrees and tasty as fuck!

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You may want to turn that temperature down to between 95 and 110 F max. All of my books regarding terpenes, essential oils, and herbology clearly state that above 110F you start losing terps very fast and others start to become damaged and oxidize. I am sure if you keep it 110F or lower you will notice even more terps in there.

There are 144 different known terpenes in cannabis. Some of them will float and some sink. Some of the terpenes are more volatile and evaporate more easily.

If you try a lower temp, let me know if you notice a difference.

Grow Goddess said:

You may want to turn that temperature down to between 95 and 110 F max. All of my books regarding terpenes, essential oils, and herbology clearly state that above 110F you start losing terps very fast and others start to become damaged and oxidize. I am sure if you keep it 110F or lower you will notice even more terps in there.

There are 144 different known terpenes in cannabis. Some of them will float and some sink. Some of the terpenes are more volatile and evaporate more easily.

If you try a lower temp, let me know if you notice a difference.

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I will give it a go. I have tasted some headband shatter done at low temps in a vac oven that was amazingly tasty. Typically I do not like shatter so much because of the flavor loss. It looks cool. I love stained glass and it reminds me of that to some extent. I have thought about making a stained glass piece of art out of shatter. Would be pretty cool.

I definately may try the natural decarb. Sounds interesting to me.....I do have a question tho.. in two of your posts you said about people scamming patients with risined buds. I dont see many people buying. Squished flattened buds but I guess someone could try and resell them

non organic sugars are typically grown with chemical fertilizers and pesticides that are systemic and leave residuals that are not tested for. thats the whole reason why some people prefer organic and non GMO foods.

i dont understand the confusion about organic alcohol. the process of making alcohol is in organic? I'm not really sure what your saying? the sugar and yeast is organic and non GMO. if you put organic vegetables in water and boil them does that process produce an in-organic soup then? i don't think I'm following your logic.

Grow Goddess said:

I have to agree with you even though I don't want to. At least when it comes to comparing 99% iso to grain alcohol and 200 proof organic ethyl.

I don't like using the grain alcohol due to the high water content unless it is only for winterizing an iso oil. This is referring to using 192 proof polish vodka. The product came out great, just a pain due to the water.

As for the 200 proof organic ethyl. It does a more dirty extraction compared to 99% iso. This may be good, but it may be bad.

You are right, it does just give me a sense of confidence for long term use when using the organic alcohol. Less concern about harming myself or my patients. This is referring to years of use. My patients and I have used 99% iso oil for over 5 years daily with no problems, but what about 15 or 20 years. Just makes me feel more safe that it is all organic. It does make me more proud to speak of my product being all organic also. Realistically, I don't think it makes a difference as long as it is being made correctly.

As for 99% iso, I must admit, it has produced the more pretty oil I have ever made, but I can't say it was any better other than the looks and easy to work with.

My biggest complaint with the 99% iso and other solvents is the stink. I don't want to be breathing that stuff, I know it is bad to do so. It is a lot more fumy than 200 proof ethyl. I feel a lot more safe using the 200 proof ethyl for the indoor purge just with a fan and no heat. It does not stink up the house. I feel that it is far less explosive and far less dangerous when it comes to inhaling the fumes.

In my opinion when it comes to the solvent being organic, like 200 proof ethyl. It is mostly because it is more safe making the product vs. the safety of ingesting it.

I am kind of an organic freak. However, if it were an emergency and I needed to make a large quantity of oil, I would not hesitate to use 99% iso and the rice cooker method. Especially for a short term, 1 to 5 year use.

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i agree wiht the safety and the fumes for sure.

have you tried washing ice wax or dry melt sift? once you have removed the green it makes a really nice absolute. if you take your time and don't put it under pressure it turns too sugar wax crumble.

hyroot said:

Unless you made the ethyl yourself with potatoes or grains or what not. Then it's not organic.

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wait the alcohol has to be home brew for it to be organic? I'm not exactly sure what your saying?

If you have skill enough to clean a dry sift to purity, a wash is pointless. I think the visual differences between iso and ethyl might have to do with ethyl's stripping power which could increase CBN in the final product. And of course neither should be used for tincture or oral ingestion, only organic i.e., grape, cane or corn etc. I do not believe ethyl is organic across the boards, food grade sure, but its compound is not contextually organic as the aforementioned. Kleenxtract does not promote the term organic in their literature.

I feel the same about rosin when using kief as starter material, no need to wash or rosin press at high heat for extended periods, just get good at sifting and try to keep the plant whole. Its understandable humans feel the need to deconstruct to begin again. Cannabis in its era of embrace is going through a deconstructive phase which is a biproduct of ingenuity and desperation. It occurs in art, music and the food world. Hash oil is fun, but as a daily driver I wouldn't recommend it.

If we are to use the word organic, might be best to keep it on the real and stick as close to flower as we can. Rosin has attempted to do just that in the big picture, but you can't escape its novelty and now the ingenuity/desperation collide. Those organic qualities which informed rosin when it started are lost now, too much heat, too much degredation, too far from the source. Its why deconstructivism in most art sucks, same with music and cuisine. A decade ago in the food world that's what you had to do to get on the map is be defined by your creative ability to deconstruct which isn't about the food, its about the chef so that got lame real quick and now nobody gives a fuck about scarmbled egg nitrogen cubes.

MJtheIndicator said:

If you have skill enough to clean a dry sift to purity, a wash is pointless. I think the visual differences between iso and ethyl might have to do with ethyl's stripping power which could increase CBN in the final product. And of course neither should be used for tincture or oral ingestion, only organic i.e., grape, cane or corn etc. I do not believe ethyl is organic, food grade sure, but its compound is not organic as the aforementioned. Kleenxtract does not promote the term organic in their literature.

I feel the same about rosin when using kief as starter material, no need to wash or rosin press at high heat for extended periods, just get good at sifting and try to keep the plant whole. Its understandable humans feel the need to deconstruct to begin again. Cannabis in its era of embrace is going through a deconstructive phase which is a biproduct of ingenuity and desperation. It occurs in art, music and the food world. Hash oil is fun, but as a daily driver I wouldn't recommend it.

If we are to use the word organic, might be best to keep it on the real and stick as close to flower as we can. Rosin has attempted to do just that in the big picture, but you can't escape its novelty and now the ingenuity/desperation collide. Those organic qualities which informed rosin when it started are lost now, too much heat, too much degredation, too far from the source. Its why deconstructivism in most art sucks, same with music and cuisine. A decade ago in the food world that's what you had to do to get on the map is be defined by your creative ability to deconstruct which isn't about the food, its about the chef so that got lame real quick and now nobody gives a fuck about scarmbled egg nitrogen cubes.

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could you go into a bit more detail about why an alcohol made with 100% organic materials start to finish why not be considered organic?

on the art note of what you said. its kinda like a ford vs chevy argument .. dull and petty to see such black and white in a world full of color. from my point of view hash is the art of extracting the pure spirt of the plant. the flower is its own art and further more i view this organic approach as very constructive to the hash art being that most of the solvent based extractions out there are petroleum base currently.

Ethanol is produced both as a petrochemical, through the hydration of ethylene and/or, via biological processes, by fermenting sugars with yeast. How about you tell me the carbon source of Kleenxtract's ethyl since you have endorsed it. If you trust their word without the company mentioning yeast or sugar in their literature, your faith is your business.

MJtheIndicator said:

Ethanol is produced both as a petrochemical, through the hydration of ethylene and/or, via biological processes, by fermenting sugars with yeast. How about you tell me the carbon source of Kleenxtract's ethyl since you have endorsed it. If you trust their word without the company mentioning yeast or sugar in their literature, your faith is your business.

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i will email them and find out. i only use them because they say they are 100% organic and 200 proof making the purge easier.

i also use http://organicalcohol.com/store/index.php/organic-grape-alcohol which is a certified organic alcohol.

could you elaborate on why there organic certification is inaccurate? its made with grapes….

people say alcohol isn't organic but why is there certified organic alcohol out there?

further more why does the organic alcohol smell, taste and extract cleaner? (thats hands on experience)

if you don't think there is a difference then i bet you voted against GMO labeling …

the organic debate is pretty well over.

there are still people who think that there is no difference and organic is a trend and to that i say fire up a dab of some pull and snap with 800 ppm + butane and grub down that MC Ds burger.

THIS IS A COPY AND PASTE FROM THE KLEEN SITE.

What Is KleenXtract?

Pure 100% (200 proof) Organic Ethyl Alcohol. KleenXtract meets or exceeds the stringent specifications of purity by the USP (United States Pharmacopeia), exhibits odorless, tasteless, and colorless characteristics.

What is KleenXtract for?

KleenXtract is mainly used as an herbal oil and resin extractor, it is also used in the production of herbal tinctures, homeopathic medicines, flower remedies, perfumes, aromatherapy oils, herbal spirits, Pharmaceutical and more.

Why is KleenXtract a better solvent than butane for herbal extracts?

• Unlike butane, KleenXtract is a food grade natural solvent without being pressurized.
• No expensive equipment
• No expanding volatile gas.
• KleenXtract is not flammable when kept under 50 degrees Fahrenheit.
• Our product passes strict guidelines and testing to be food grade, organic, and USP Compliant.
• Butane is not regulated and 10 X filtered could mean ran through an old oil filter.
• With KleenXtract De-Waxing and Winterizing are not necessary.
• Butane is made by oil companies that have major political and environmental impacts.
• KleenXtract is made by organic farmers which is our best hope for the future.

Why is KleenXtract a better solvent than Co2 for herbal extracts?

The answer is the bottom line for most people. Co2 equipment is so expensive that even if it lasts 2 years it still adds hundreds of dollars a week in equipment cost to a business plan. Ethyl Alcohol (KleenXtract) is usually used to filter and winterize Co2 extract after extraction, just skip the steps and expense.

What is the difference between alcohol proof and percentage?

Each degree of alcohol proof is equal to 0.5% alcohol by volume. As an example, 100 proof is the same as 50% alcohol by volume. 200 proof is the same as 100% pure Alcohol.

Why is there a $27.00 a gallon tax? Do I have to pay?

KleenXtract is pure alcohol and considered taxable alcohol. The Federal Government requires an excise tax of $13.50 per proof gallon (200 proof, pure alcohol =$27.00). A tax exempt certificate is required to be on file with KleenXtract for us not to charge the Federal excise tax on pure alcohol. Eligibility for exemption is determined by the ATF (Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms). This is not an EIN or the ability to collect sales tax. KleenXtract does not make any profit from collecting the tax, nor do we receive a portion of the tax. Only denatured Ethanol products do not require the payment of a federal excise tax.

What is denatured alcohol?

Unlike pure alcohol and KleenXtract, denatured alcohol has toxic additives which make it unfit for human consumption.

Why has KleenXtract added a Hazmat Handling Fee?

The Department of Transportation has added a $28 Handling Fee of Hazardous Materials to our product. Mandatory enforcement by Fedex and UPS on only 1 Gallon and 5 Gallon Packages. Please contact us if you have any additional concerns or questions. Thank You.


they don't list the sugars they use so I'm going to email them to find out. I'm going to also ask about the strain of yeast and their whole process from start to finish. its a very very clean alcohol compared to many that i have used but more info would be nice.

MJtheIndicator said:

Ethanol is produced both as a petrochemical, through the hydration of ethylene and/or, via biological processes, by fermenting sugars with yeast. How about you tell me the carbon source of Kleenxtract's ethyl since you have endorsed it. If you trust their word without the company mentioning yeast or sugar in their literature, your faith is your business.

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i sent them an email. i will copy and paste the response as soon as they send one.

I doubt transparency as regards the company you endorse, their MDMS doesn't read as transparent. They are simply a cannacentric chemical provider who did some leg work to find a low price wholesale source for ethyl. Ethylene is a hydrocarbon, ethylene's hydrate is ethyl alcohol. The term "organic" could also apply to ethyl produced from ethylene considering its carbon makeup. Its none of my business why or where you produce hash oil using solvent, but the term organic doesn't make ethanol any less a solvent. We enjoy alchohol for its polar relation to cannabis, but consider hydrogen bonding which causes pure ethanol to be hygroscopic to the extent that it readily absorbs water from the air.

The polar nature of the hydroxyl group causes ethanol to dissolve many ionic compounds, notably sodium and potassium hydroxides, magnesium chloride, calcium chloride, ammonium chloride, ammonium bromide, and sodium bromide. Sodium and potassium chlorides are slightly soluble in ethanol. Because the ethanol molecule also has a nonpolar end, it will also dissolve nonpolar substances, including most essential oils and numerous flavoring, coloring, and medicinal agents.

As was mentioned earlier in the thread regarding inorganics, I feel the motive in dialogue here is to frame the usage of the term organic in an intelligent albeit scientific light rather than communicating with one another from a sales-pitch mindset. My point is that ethanol is a component in most malt liquors, but to brand a malt liquor as organic is absurd considering its effect. For what its worth I would never "smoke" oil from a grape source, the term organic in such regard is redundant, moot and unnecessary. That is unless you get off on the combustion of such elements, but again the term organic in this instance is simply pointless. I do admire the architecture of a thread like this. Its as if to say look how folks will talk in circles about why alcohol can or can't be organic, the joke essentially stems from the ennui of an overall BHO downtrend.

Mr.CrumWell said:

What Is KleenXtract?

Pure 100% (200 proof) Organic Ethyl Alcohol. KleenXtract meets or exceeds the stringent specifications of purity by the USP (United States Pharmacopeia), exhibits odorless, tasteless, and colorless characteristics.

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THESE ARE META SEARCH RESULTS FOR THE TERM "ORGANIC" AS IT APPEARS ON kleenxtract.com

<Buy Pure Organic Ethyl Alcohol at Cheap Price>
<KleenXtract the all natural botanical extractor. NO BUTANE, BHO, Shatter, Snap, Wax, Glass Wear Cleaner, Extraction Method, bho, organic alcohol>

ITS JUST A TAG #ORGANIC to increase seo results in search engines

Contrast with someone like Rick SImpson who has been using ethanol as a base in his hash oil for some time, quite the prominent fellow within the greater cannabis community. You might not find the term organic on his website even though the alcohol might very well be. I appreciate your open-source attitude and I think all humans could always use a bit of self-reflection in terms of delivery. Incidentally, my vote is for healing and the eternal quest to end suffering, not arbitrary adjectives and socio-placebos.

FWIW, from a food labelling perspective, something I have years of experience in though not with alcohol. The difference between an organic beer and a conventional one would be that the malt, barley, etc. would need to be grown according to organic standards. So an organic grape ethanol would be made from organically grown grapes.

From a moral perspective, just as I don't believe a mac n cheese mix is ever organic...my opinion is that once we start using solvents, it ain't organic hash. I am Kleen Extract user as well, so not dissing it. But a bubble, dry sift, or charras would be an organic hash...

MJtheIndicator said:

I doubt transparency as regards the company you endorse, their MDMS doesn't read as transparent. They are simply a cannacentric chemical provider who did some leg work to find a low price wholesale source for ethyl. Ethylene is a hydrocarbon, ethylene's hydrate is ethyl alcohol. The term "organic" could also apply to ethyl produced from ethylene considering its carbon makeup. Its none of my business why or where you produce hash oil using solvent, but the term organic doesn't make ethanol any less a solvent. We enjoy alchohol for its polar relation to cannabis, but consider hydrogen bonding which causes pure ethanol to be hygroscopic to the extent that it readily absorbs water from the air.

The polar nature of the hydroxyl group causes ethanol to dissolve many ionic compounds, notably sodium and potassium hydroxides, magnesium chloride, calcium chloride, ammonium chloride, ammonium bromide, and sodium bromide. Sodium and potassium chlorides are slightly soluble in ethanol. Because the ethanol molecule also has a nonpolar end, it will also dissolve nonpolar substances, including most essential oils and numerous flavoring, coloring, and medicinal agents.

As was mentioned earlier in the thread regarding inorganics, I feel the motive in dialogue here is to frame the usage of the term organic in an intelligent albeit scientific light rather than communicating with one another from a sales-pitch mindset. My point is that ethanol is a component in most malt liquors, but to brand a malt liquor as organic is absurd considering its effect. For what its worth I would never "smoke" oil from a grape source, the term organic in such regard is redundant, moot and unnecessary. That is unless you get off on the combustion of such elements, but again the term organic in this instance is simply pointless. I do admire the architecture of a thread like this. Its as if to say look how folks will talk in circles about why alcohol can or can't be organic, the joke essentially stems from the ennui of an overall BHO downtrend.

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you went into the chemistry of alcohol a bit.. but I still don't understand why you would consider it not organic if 100% organic materials are used to create it… there are local craft brews of beer and kumbucha where I'm at. would you say they should not be putting an organic label of there product because of the fermentation of alcohol and alcohol being present in the final product?

MJtheIndicator said:

THESE ARE META SEARCH RESULTS FOR THE TERM "ORGANIC" AS IT APPEARS ON kleenxtract.com

<Buy Pure Organic Ethyl Alcohol at Cheap Price>
<KleenXtract the all natural botanical extractor. NO BUTANE, BHO, Shatter, Snap, Wax, Glass Wear Cleaner, Extraction Method, bho, organic alcohol>

ITS JUST A TAG #ORGANIC to increase seo results in search engines

Contrast with someone like Rick SImpson who has been using ethanol as a base in his hash oil for some time, quite the prominent fellow within the greater cannabis community. You might not find the term organic on his website even though the alcohol might very well be. I appreciate your open-source attitude and I think all humans could always use a bit of self-reflection in terms of delivery. Incidentally, my vote is for healing and the eternal quest to end suffering, not arbitrary adjectives and socio-placebos.

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yea he also told us either was cool to use in his first video "run from the cure"

if you think my angle is marketing and not an actual healthy oil for those around me i bless with this plant and the whole world you are mistaken.

i understand it can be fearful in a world of materialism but i have forgave that karma long ago and I'm hear to transcend knowledge and healing before i return to the source once again.

this oil cannot be made with flowers grown under artificial light or with artificial soil and nutrients. everything about this oil comes from a health stand point. its made seasonally to ensure health for the planet. it takes so much material to make this oil and I'm just partially giving it out tot hose i heal.

GrowinDad said:

FWIW, from a food labelling perspective, something I have years of experience in though not with alcohol. The difference between an organic beer and a conventional one would be that the malt, barley, etc. would need to be grown according to organic standards. So an organic grape ethanol would be made from organically grown grapes.

From a moral perspective, just as I don't believe a mac n cheese mix is ever organic...my opinion is that once we start using solvents, it ain't organic hash. I am Kleen Extract user as well, so not dissing it. But a bubble, dry sift, or charras would be an organic hash...

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yes i believe the term your looking for is organic solvent less hash

this is organic absolute oil

hash and extracts are different.

i think the difference would be compared to an organic diet of cooked foods vrs and organic diet of raw uncooked food

raw i guess would be considered more natural.. but you could still eat organic both ways ..