Polyploid Hermi

LuvYaBud

Well-Known Member
Greetings Growers.

I've got an Afghan Kush Ryder at day 26 that's gone ployploid at the 2nd internodes only. Pistils are developing very slowly, as are a few male preflowers.
Wondering whether to cut it now or ride it out.
Has anyone experienced a polyploid hermi.
Was it worth seeing thru to the end.
 

4ftRoots

Well-Known Member
Greetings Growers.

I've got an Afghan Kush Ryder at day 26 that's gone ployploid at the 2nd internodes only. Pistils are developing very slowly, as are a few male preflowers.
Wondering whether to cut it now or ride it out.
Has anyone experienced a polyploid hermi.
Was it worth seeing thru to the end.
I heard from @Mohican that a plant that develops male and female flowers is apparently called a super male. I would ride it out and see what you get. Could be a masterpiece.
 

Mohican

Well-Known Member
I had a few breeders tell me that they were something good. Not sure whether they were trying to help me or screw with me.

I still trashed the plants. No hermi traits for me! I love regular seeds and true female and male plants.

Cheers,
Mo
 

LuvYaBud

Well-Known Member
I had a few breeders tell me that they were something good. Not sure whether they were trying to help me or screw with me.

I still trashed the plants. No hermi traits for me! I love regular seeds and true female and male plants.

Cheers,
Mo
I've come across polyploidy before and the yield was slightly impressive. Any hermis have always been pulled.
Its the mixing of the 2 traits that's got me stumped.
I keep saying I'm going back to regular photos but you cant beat the speed and simplicity of autos, especially AKR.
 

LuvYaBud

Well-Known Member
Nice 1 Mo. Truly amazing, but at the end of the season their still stinkin males. Ive had autos yield 200g dry. Seriously amazing shit from 10 weeks.
If resources weren't so tight id let it go full term. We'll see. Any more male pods and its chop time.

Cheers dude,
Al.
 

Abiqua

Well-Known Member
Super male = polygamodioecious [genotype] super Male [one type of phenotype] which could also be both homo/heterozygous to keep adding in complexity.....

Polyploid is a Genotype not a Phenotype! multiple sets of DNA, which could mean even more varied phenotypism.

Look up Phylos Genetics...they are doing a study on clearing some of this up.....
 

LuvYaBud

Well-Known Member
hi

its called trifoliate[three] quadra foliate[four

polyploid is some thing else altogether..[at the chromesome level ]
no i am not a scientist[lol]..or want to be one

have good thread

Hi.
The branches in question are trifoliate,they also have flattening of the stems. Are both of these not characteristics of a ployploid plant. A fuck up on the chromosomal level you mention. I'm not been a dick but I get the genetics. I was curious only because I have this trifoliate polyplod trait that also has hermaphrodite traits and wondered if anyone else had seen it. I would never consider pulling it if it wasn't for the bollocks.
Peace dude,
Al
 

LuvYaBud

Well-Known Member
Super male = polygamodioecious [genotype] super Male [one type of phenotype] which could also be both homo/heterozygous to keep adding in complexity.....

Polyploid is a Genotype not a Phenotype! multiple sets of DNA, which could mean even more varied phenotypism.

Look up Phylos Genetics...they are doing a study on clearing some of this up.....
Hi.
Back on the research wagon I go. Obviously never to old to learn something.
Cheers dude,
Al.
 

Abiqua

Well-Known Member
Are they true tri leaves? Like three cotyls?

Another term:
whorled phylotaxy :)
 
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Abiqua

Well-Known Member
Hi.
The branches in question are trifoliate,they also have flattening of the stems. Are both of these not characteristics of a ployploid plant. A fuck up on the chromosomal level you mention. I'm not been a dick but I get the genetics. I was curious only because I have this trifoliate polyplod trait that also has hermaphrodite traits and wondered if anyone else had seen it. I would never consider pulling it if it wasn't for the bollocks.
Peace dude,
Al

The problem is seperating what is genotypic expression and what is phenotypic expression [Breeding for terps in a Nutshell] . Yes, your guess might be correct, but using phenotypic determinations [seeing flat stems, trifolation etc] for the genotype is SLIPPERY slope....Only a genetic determination right now, would give you 100%....our eyeballs make BAD genotypic indicators :)...by that I mean phenotype is NOT a good indicator of genotype....
 

LuvYaBud

Well-Known Member
Are they true tri leaves? Like three cotyls?

Another term:
whirled phylotaxy :)
Growth started normal. The trifoliate leaf sets started on the 2nd internode around day 20, I noticed the flat stems, and the growth tip had split into 2. Id be happy with that,its more bud sites. What's pissing me off is the male preflowers. Is it worth keeping. Development of the pistils seems slow.
 

LuvYaBud

Well-Known Member
The problem is seperating what is genotypic expression and what is phenotypic expression [Breeding for terps in a Nutshell] . Yes, your guess might be correct, but using phenotypic determinations [seeing flat stems, trifolation etc] for the genotype is SLIPPERY slope....Only a genetic determination right now, would give you 100%....our eyeballs make BAD genotypic indicators :)...by that I mean phenotype is NOT a good indicator of genotype....
I agree that u cant guess genotype from phenotype but with a stable strain such as Afghan Kush Ryder, any abnormalities like this are probably relating to genotype.
 

Abiqua

Well-Known Member
Growth started normal. The trifoliate leaf sets started on the 2nd internode around day 20, I noticed the flat stems, and the growth tip had split into 2. Id be happy with that,its more bud sites. What's pissing me off is the male preflowers. Is it worth keeping. Development of the pistils seems slow.
Have you ever kept and popped new seeds? All female?

I grow seeds out all the time like this...out of 4-5 strains I play around with...1 just will not get rid of the intersex trait and is always popping pre flowers....the rest pop preflowers about 10% of the time, still working after 5 years, just now getting a taste :peace: but I have never popped a true male....I get the supermales, but I want to send some of my leaf material to Phylos and see it if is male going lady or a lady going lady...


Is it worth it? well i am of a different opinion on saving genetics than most....Intersex is trait that WILL NOT ever be bred of the cannabis genome, at least naturally...Even what we consider "regular" or non-fem strains can intersex....so all these terms are all misnomers for the most parts, because they are all out of context...

SuperMales if it exists, is really just a reproductive technique shared by a variety of other plants in male dominated gene pools...sexual rhodalization of sorts.


I agree that u cant guess genotype from phenotype but with a stable strain such as Afghan Kush Ryder, any abnormalities like this are probably relating to genotype.
and you absolutely right, you know enough to make that observation, I was just kind of generally washing over earlier....

Homozygous / Heterzygous ....

I tend to agree as well, if the plant has a bunch of homozygous looking plants and then a hetero comes out...yeah, don't overlook a genotypic expression in that case....:joint:
That's definitely a solid point, the law of averages definitely helps in that case...growing a strain out multiple multiple times, helps so much....not just run an gun to the next and newest...:peace:
 

OLD MOTHER SATIVA

Well-Known Member
but i must agree ..retract what i said..i was generalizing
it "might" be possible for polypoldism to just happen..it is nature
however i think this thread was about the dif between trifoliate and poly ploid and being able to identify it visually..nahh
 

LuvYaBud

Well-Known Member
but i must agree ..retract what i said..i was generalizing
it "might" be possible for polypoldism to just happen..it is nature
however i think this thread was about the dif between trifoliate and poly ploid and being able to identify visually..nahh

I started the thread simple because the plant was showing male preflowers. It going trifoliate is great, more bud sites. I raised the question because the strain is AKR and generally very stable, and whether any of our fellow growers had seen this genetic expression in this strain and seen it thru to the end. A question to which I've still not found an answer.
Thanks for your input tho dude.
Peace,
Al.
 

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
Read the above posts dude. Of course genetic abnormalities can just "happen".
Your arguing something that you clearly dont fully understand.
STFW? "Just Happen?"

How about a pic of the plant !!!!

Polyploidy is considered RARE in Cannabis and Canna is not generally considered prone to abnormal cell division in mitoses or meiosis....

It can be done by chemical and that is very hard to do because the chemical is so toxic that plant and seed exposure may only supply a success at say maybe 1 in 100 if your lucky!

THIS is what Polyploid blooming looks like......

2.jpg

polyploid.jpg

If your reading anything "Billy Bud" is saying on polyploid Canna......He's got a lot wrong..Like his claims of 2x the potency (up to 40%) in the plants them selves........I saw a poly plant in the late 70's to maybe 81 or 82......Nice looking plant - we could not try it! It was a chem treated plant and it had to be reversed or breed to get to the next off spring to be safe to consume.

Doc
 
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