Who's Got The Fostiest Buds? Let's See How Frosty A Bud Can Really Get?

WestDenverPioneer

WestDenverPioneer

Well-Known Member
st0wandgrow said:
I hate to break it to you, but that's genetics. There are no tips or magic elixors that will take an otherwise average plant and turn it in to a frost monster. You either have to sort through hundreds of beans to find an exceptional plant, or know someone that has already done the work and is willing to part with a clone.
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There is some truth to that. Genetics clearly plays a strong role in the end product. Having good genetics will help but there are many more variables to producing quality flowers than just genetics.

Using the same ingredients and same equipment, could you cook the same meal as Chef Ramsay? Some people might answer yes, most would admit that the trick to the good meal is in the skill and years of training.

Ingredients, setups, and genetics can only do so much for the grower.
 
Sativied

Sativied

Well-Known Member
I agree but still, you can have such great genetics and still not get those results if the grow setup/environment isn't ideal. Oh and maybe he used a UV light :)

frostCH99.jpg

C99^^

Yes, C99. Turns out Cannalope Haze (including previous shots and the dad of those frosty seedlings) is actually C99.
 
oldfogey8

oldfogey8

Well-Known Member
st0wandgrow said:
I hate to break it to you, but that's genetics. There are no tips or magic elixors that will take an otherwise average plant and turn it in to a frost monster. You either have to sort through hundreds of beans to find an exceptional plant, or know someone that has already done the work and is willing to part with a clone.
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i doubt i could grow a blue dream seed under a christmas tree bulb in beach sand using distilled water and get the same results...
 
st0wandgrow

st0wandgrow

Well-Known Member
WestDenverPioneer said:
There is some truth to that. Genetics clearly plays a strong role in the end product. Having good genetics will help but there are many more variables to producing quality flowers than just genetics.

Using the same ingredients and same equipment, could you cook the same meal as Chef Ramsay? Some people might answer yes, most would admit that the trick to the good meal is in the skill and years of training.

Ingredients, setups, and genetics can only do so much for the grower.
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Ingredients in a dish are not a living thing with pre-determined dna. Apples and oranges

I know it makes people feel good to think that THEY made that sparkly plant, but in reality the genetics are the single most important factor. Of course a complete noob may screw up an otherwise nice plant, but if you hand a seasoned grower a pack of shitty genetics, and you hand an average grower a pack of superior genetics, the average grower will end up with the better end product every time.
 
WestDenverPioneer

WestDenverPioneer

Well-Known Member
st0wandgrow said:
the average grower will end up with the better end product every time.
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An average grower can only produce average product, nothing more.
Sometimes an average grower can get lucky and pull off a decent crop. However, there is no consistency to the next crop and the luck often runs out. As the grower develops more skill, there is a greater chance you'll see a better product.

Garden techniques play a larger role than genetics. The skilled grower will always produce a better product regardless of genetics. I've done it with bag seed. I've done it with genetics from other people that later couldn't recognize my end results. What happened to make mine different than the person I got it from? Technique, skill, and so on.

Environmental stress and poor technique cannot be overcome by having good genetics.
Good genetics helps, but it won't do the work for you.

There is no such thing as "predetermined" or guaranteed DNA. DNA can give you predictable traits and that's it. A pure breed dog has predictable traits but there's no guarantee that dog will hunt without the proper training by its owner.
 
oldfogey8

oldfogey8

Well-Known Member
st0wandgrow said:
Really? Then why did you quote my comment in your response?

Are you new to how this works?
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my first comment before you started to be a troll was to westdenver. my replies to you were in response to your grow-snob reply. i come here for advice and to learn. i am aware genetics play a part. i am also aware that a grow would go nowhere using a christmas tree bulb. and i am also aware there are people who just can't help but need to feel superior. go ahead. feel superior. you must be a legend. i still need to learn and will probably go to my grave not knowing everything...
 
st0wandgrow

st0wandgrow

Well-Known Member
oldfogey8 said:
my first comment before you started to be a troll was to westdenver. my replies to you were in response to your grow-snob reply. i come here for advice and to learn. i am aware genetics play a part. i am also aware that a grow would go nowhere using a christmas tree bulb. and i am also aware there are people who just can't help but need to feel superior. go ahead. feel superior. you must be a legend. i still need to learn and will probably go to my grave not knowing everything...
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You've got it all wrong. If I were trying to be "superior" and swing my dick I would tell you that my plants sparkle because I'm such an awesome grower, and I have a hat full of super secret tricks to make it that way. I'm doing just the opposite. Instead of joining in on the ego-stroking exercise I'm telling it how it is. Genetics. You can't magically turn inferior genetics in to some prized plant by adding special sauce, or raising your light 1.5 inches for the last 4 days of flower, or any other nonsense that gets tossed around forums like this.
 
st0wandgrow

st0wandgrow

Well-Known Member
WestDenverPioneer said:
An average grower can only produce average product, nothing more.
Sometimes an average grower can get lucky and pull off a decent crop. However, there is no consistency to the next crop and the luck often runs out. As the grower develops more skill, there is a greater chance you'll see a better product.

Garden techniques play a larger role than genetics. The skilled grower will always produce a better product regardless of genetics. I've done it with bag seed. I've done it with genetics from other people that later couldn't recognize my end results. What happened to make mine different than the person I got it from? Technique, skill, and so on.

Environmental stress and poor technique cannot be overcome by having good genetics.
Good genetics helps, but it won't do the work for you.

There is no such thing as "predetermined" or guaranteed DNA. DNA can give you predictable traits and that's it. A pure breed dog has predictable traits but there's no guarantee that dog will hunt without the proper training by its owner.
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You keep on believing that. Anyone that knows a lick about botany will tell you that genetics play a FARRRR more important role than "gardening techniques". I have a plant in my garden right now that has a ridiculous amount of trichome coverage on it. First time I've ever grown it. Beside it sits a plant that I've worked with for about 3 years now. How do you explain the newer plant, in the same garden under the same light given the same amount of tlc being superior to the plant I've held for years? Is there are garden-ninja that sneaks in to my grow at night and sprinkles the new plant with pixy dust?
 
WestDenverPioneer

WestDenverPioneer

Well-Known Member
oldfogey8 said:
my first comment before you started to be a troll was to westdenver.
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That's cool because I thought the same thing about your comments.
I know I have talent. People tell me all the time. But I'm not a closed door that knows it all. I don't have a chip on my shoulder. I constantly seek more info and new ideas, which is the only reason I got to be where I am with my talents. I enjoy sharing what I know and I wish everyone could grow as good as I do. Ultimately, what works for me may not work for you. What works for you may not work for me.
I enjoy showing off in the regards of showing people how it can be done, or to show what else is possible. My favorite line is "you don't know what you don't know".

Getting back on topic of frosty buds...

Flo - awesome purple Thai
She will give you the most ravenous case of munchies you've ever had. You might go from pasta, to ice cream, to a bag of chips, and then eat an entire bag of m&m's before you finally pass out.
Go easy with her...

flo2.jpg
 
WestDenverPioneer

WestDenverPioneer

Well-Known Member
If genetics played a greater role than technique.... then why aren't there any pics on leafly that look like the one I just posted?
If they are all the same Flo, why don't any of the pictures match the description?
http://www.leafly.com/hybrid/flo

Why isn't the leafly photo gallery of Flo filled with purple, pear-shaped buds?
The so-called "predetermined dna" of Flo should resemble the profile.... but as I've explained, it has to be grown properly, and that all comes down to technique.
 
Sativied

Sativied

Well-Known Member
st0wandgrow said:
Anyone that knows a lick about botany will tell you that genetics play a FARRRR more important role than "gardening techniques".
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Even more so with cannabis, which requires relatively little garden skills.

Anyway, you guys are making it such a black and white issue. It's not garden skills vs genetics, it's a combination. You cannot logically disprove the influence of genetics by stating the fact that gardening skills (Or imo better said 'the environment' the grower creates) play a role. You also cannot logically disprove the influence of grower by stating the obvious fact that genetics play a role. They are not mutually excluded but go hand-in-hand. The "limit" is genetically determined, but it won't reach that limit in a non-optimal environment. Let the guy take some pride in growing such frosty mj.
 
st0wandgrow

st0wandgrow

Well-Known Member
Sativied said:
Even more so with cannabis, which requires relatively little garden skills.

Anyway, you guys are making it such a black and white issue. It's not garden skills vs genetics, it's a combination. You cannot logically disprove the influence of genetics by stating the fact that gardening skills (Or imo better said 'the environment' the grower creates) play a role. You also cannot logically disprove the influence of grower by stating the obvious fact that genetics play a role. They are not mutually excluded but go hand-in-hand. The "limit" is genetically determined, but it won't reach that limit in a non-optimal environment. Let the guy take some pride in growing such frosty mj.
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That's a reasonable position. IMO, our job as marijuana gardeners is to create a good, stable enviornment, and satisfy the plants basic needs (light, water, nutrients, O2/CO2). That's basic stuff that any person should be able to master within months, and to that end a grower can impact his/her plants. BUT, beyond that a gardener cannot magically turn a plant that tests at 10% THC in to some disco ball that tests at 20% THC. You know that as well as I do. For someone to say that they can get better results every time with inferior plants than someone else could with genetically superior plants is a load of BS.

He should be proud of his plant, but he should also be able to conceed that he found himself a nice variety and not insist that it was due to his super duper skills and tricks.
 
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