My Coco Retardation - Re-occuring Seedling Problem
Hi everyone!
Been lurking around rollitup for quite a long time now, love the community and all the knowledge on display! About six months ago I finally thought id gathered enough knowledge to begin my own indoor grows, and coco coir mixed with perlite made the most sense to me for the growing medium.
Last run was great with the Nirvana NL! Fast healthy new growth, tight internodes, could read the plant and feed accordingly and lst'ed very successfully which all in all yielded me over 2.5 zips from a 16inch tall bush. So all thats good except for...
The seedling stage! Every time a seed in my household touches coco it turns to crap. Each time I get to the point where the first two setts of true leaves have grown out...Then the stunting starts! Yellowing leaves, droopy unhappy looking leaves and no good growth for basically up to two weeks
Now I thought I got the hang of coco last run, but clearly didn't! I germinated 2 Arjans Haze #3 girls around 2 weeks ago, and have the same set of problems as last run. First real leaves appear which is always followed by rapid deterioration in color and vigor.
The enviromental factors are as follows....
-Light-400w hps, approx 1 foot from tops. Was running 24hours now running 20hours. (son-t globe, no cooltube)
-Exhaust- 8inch centrifugal grow-lush. Passive intakes, Carbon filter.
-Medium- 60% canna coco 40% perlite.
-Feed- For seedling H&G base nutes with Canna Rhizotonic. 2-4ml per litre of the rhizo. Feed every water, every 48 hours.
-PH- Ranging from 5.6-5.8 for the feed water, never tested medium, but flush with 5.8 water regardless of being canna coco so I think I'm safe there...
-EC- 0.3-0.4 from the beginning of the first true leaves, usually stepping up to 0.6-0.8 at second set then to 1.2 etc etc.
-Water- Tap water with an EC of ~0.1
-Temp and RH- ~70F lights on and 40% RH
Now the things I have tried so far (changing one variable at a time to try figure out my continuing problem) are: Move the light upwards to 16inch approx, water/feed less often, flushed, and after none of those helped at all, as of yesterday raised to EC to approx 1.0 (yes probably the wrong move)
I really hope someone can tell me how to improve what I'm doing, as I'm slightly OCD and losing all this time in the seedling stage is more time waiting to see my first gorgeous sativas in action
Anyway here are some pics (want closer shots etc, just ask!) of the two Haze ladies and I thought I'd throw in a pic of my NL clone as well which is well on its way to dank heaven. I included it because they all receive similar treatment/environment and I can see the haze girls ending up looking just as bad if I dont improve my game....
GHSAH3#1 side.jpgGHSAH3#1.jpgGHSAH3#2 side.jpgGHSAH3#2.jpgNirvana NL clone side.jpgNirvana NL clone.jpg
Group shot.jpg
As you can see, they look bloody horrible! (even worse in natural sunlight so i found out!) I apoligise to them everyday lol...Im not too worried about the NL dying, just my little sativa babies ;p Thanks a ton for reading my long ass post, looking forward to chatting with you all!
Spent the last hour reading about light bleaching, although its existence seems to be highly debated? Anyhow, just went and measured the distance from globe to plants and it was actually around the 10" mark (not 12" like previously thought) but the canopy is as cool as a cucumber, as in cant feel radiating heat at all at canopy level....not that I know for sure thats the problem, but moved the light to about 14". Suppose it wont hurt anything, so why not try!
For the love of pure relaxation.
Mixing Perlite with coco does nothing. Coco provides excellent drainage and airation on its own. The problem is the coco. If you use coco you just about have to use coco specific nutes from day one. In a soil mix mag, cal and k issues are a near guarantee. Last one I tried coco mix on had issues all the way to flower therefore I am expecting it to produce very little.
See no Evil, Speak no Evil, Smoke no Evil
I am using coco specific house & garden brand nutrients, and have always mixed the coco with perlite with good results (not saying its correct, im no expert) its just this damn seedling stage (first two weeks or so, which ends up being longer due to slow growth) I always have problems with, then the plants pick back up, regain color and grow like crazy. You think the perlite has something to do with this?
For the love of pure relaxation.
try raising the pH to 6.0 if that dont help i dont know what to tell you.
and also pH you solution right after adding nutrients then wait 12 hours and pH it again make sure your tap is not playing games with your pH. it can swing this is why i gave up on pH and started using Dol lime on everything.
Have you had success with coco amended with lime? Yet another subject that always seems to be debated... I will raise the ph to 6.0 and ill mix my nutes tonight for tomorrows feeding (I usually mix the bases one at a time, then additives, then ph, then let sit for only half an hour to test again and its always the same)
What specific nutrient do you think I have the problem with? As I assume I should try a ph of 6.0 to make certain things more available?
Thanks for the feedback guys
For the love of pure relaxation.
This sound like a form of Hillbilly Hydro
I tried it in rockwool didn't work either
Went back to dirt~
Grow Journal~http://www.rollitup.org/blogs/213043...ttogrower.html
Latest Grow~Advance Nutrients with FFOF is Highly Recommended
Apart from my problems early in growth, all my coco grows have outperformed my soil grows...especially in yield and vigor. (cant really compare smell/taste, thats personal opinion) So if its hillbilly, that's how I roll
For the love of pure relaxation.
dont use nutes for around first 2 weeks, that could be the problem rhizo is ok but seedlings dont need the nutes for a while
I have 4 seeds in coco now, 10 days old (since cracking) nice and healthy only started giving them rhizo 2 days ago.
Last edited by TicKle; 08-22-2012 at 03:10 AM.
When I'm not in the grow room, I breed Unicorns.
http://www.rollitup.org/grow-journal...g-some-uk.html
Feeding too early is most likely my continuing problem, as it must have something to do with my schedule, which stays the same (as does the problem)
TicKle, would you be kind enough to post a pic of your 10 day old seedlings? I just want to get an idea on what stage of growth you start feeding, as everyone seedlings seem to grow at very different rates! Then maybe I can go about curing my"coco retardation"
Take it easy
For the love of pure relaxation.
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