thexception
Well-Known Member
posted this in my journal/thread on my grow, copy/pasted below, because I hope this to be seen by at least some highly experienced growers, who will kindly provide some input. Kind of long, but trying to explain everything that led up to my one flowering plant dying in less then 10 HOURS!??? TIA for any input/comments/replies
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okay, one plant is of my main flowering plants is 99% DEAD. I say 99%, because the only reason it isn't 100% dead is because I haven't the energy today to dig it up, check roots, crack stem, get soil samples, etc & then throw the damn thing in the trash, lol. So WHAT the hell happened? Well I am hoping to shed some light on that & hope after I do all of the above in the next day or two, I might have a clue. I am SO tired today & have a full schedule tomorrow, so probably won't get around to it until Monday. (Been busy the last few days, at the car auction, & wrapping everything up; just gave our 18 yr old her first car).
So this was (the good) thankfully the smallest & weaker of the 2 bigger plants, (the bad) but also the ONLY one I had used Uncle Ben's Topping Method on, & therefore will have NO results for this strain using it, nor comparing the end yield side by side with the untopped bigger healthier plant, FUCK ME! LOL. Damn that irks the shit out of me.
Okay, so I have known for at least the last 2-3 weeks, this plant was obviously not as strong, in spite of the natural fact it was about 4-6 days behind the other since seed, but because it was still not as flowered at it should have been, it was having issues, which I was attempting to address as what I expected was deficiencies & a bit of underwatering for a day or two. And the only difference between the 2 plants, other then a few days in age, was one was topped (now dead) & one was not, THRIVING still.
No matter what, I completely blame myself in the fact that regardless of what I found out, (if I do) to be the outcome of why this sucker died, I SHOULD have adjusted & flowered sooner, just to alleviate the pain in the ASS height restrictions I had FULL knowledge could occur. I knew the strain I was working with & know how this goes, yet I still chose to be bullheaded wanting to veg a full 60 days, to test the full yield potential (topped vs not), even though I KNEW the height could become my nemises, as it has.
So, this dead plant, bottom I'd say 1/4 of leaves started dropping alot about 2 weeks ago; first diagnosed from day or two of underwatering as when they shifted into overdrive wasn't aware already their intake had increased that much. SO...I thought it was from underwatering, yet, the other plant had no ill effect, which I attributed to it was stronger overalll, had always been the biggest/tallest from the start etc. & was not stressed from topping.
Then leaves started to yellow, drop off the plant or damn near, where a slight tug they'd come off, this happened on the bigger plant as well, but not as much. And on this dead plant, earlier on I felt there was more of a pronounced mag deficiency exhibited by new growth & yellower upper leaves. So I treated both the SAME way, as I figured both were bound to have the same defeiciency, even though only the one was showing more ill effects. Gave more mag via epsom salts, started giving nitrogen (along with my bloom ferts) because I am was quite certain I didn't give enough N in veg, because this plant (known in this strain to be sensitive to ferts) was given very little because after they showed the least little burn I backed WAY off; so of course I thought them being stronger now, no problem & being this strain flowers for approx. 67 days, knew what they had would not get them through without inhibiting the bud production to full potential.
I had a problem with the ph a little over about 2 weeks ago also, was too high & had been running high due to nute addage, so got some ph down. So flushed them, used ph down & continued on. Then again, about a week ago, used ph down, only this time, used too much, SHIT, so flushed them...but here was my real nucklehead move (and if you knew me u would know this is a RARE occassion, as I am blamed as being a perfectionist) so I flush them out, but was so tired (my exuse) right after I did, I use the SAME premixed water with TOO Much of the ph down I JUST used, & therefore u guessed it, FUCK...I had to flush them again. MORE work for me, highly frustrating, GRRRRR. Then ph down again. Now I will say on this weaker plant, it was still a little low after my 2 flushes (at about 5.5) but I was NOT about to flush again, figured next nute treatment would bring it up, & was tired. Amazingly it "seemed" this had no ill effect on either plant, & not proven yet that it did.
Okay, now weaker plant, still not looking much better almost 2 weeks later, lower leaves still droopy, yellowing not changed worse or better, time to get some calmag. Again treat both plants, this was probably on Wednesday. NOW...on Thursday, I finally decide, okay now that the bigger plant has made it to 1/4 inch in height above the bottom of my light & I don't have the height to lengthen the canopy either, I am going to have to bend my now flowering plants. So I quickly realize, with no side lighting to work with, the yield in both plants, especially the bigger one, is going to suffer if I don't get them both bent underneath the light. I also quickly realize that bending on towards the other is going to do 2 things: first, if I bend the big one over the smaller one I greatly decrease its bud potential. Second, the lower 3rd of both plants is going to receive virtually no light. So, here is what I did.
First I gently tied down the bigger plant, then I interwove the smaller plant in between the bigger one, tying it down, so it would be like a pair of hands, fingers folded together like in prayer, this way both the strongest budding topps receive adequate light. Then I trim off the lower 1/3 of the leaves & smaller branches; and I am someone who is never a proponent of doing so unless necessary (I hate hearing people prune healthy leaves) but I am not removing big fan leaves, simply smaller branches & leaves that aren't going to receive any light, nor in the weaker plant are doing great anyway. I figure in this case, this can only help each plant concentrate its energy on the healthy buds & 2/3 of the upper plant, both of which healthy.
Now, I did this during the lights on period (a couple hours after they came on) on Thursday evening, the next morning I awoke to hearing WTF, but I thought it was because the love of my life saw them intertwined, & I was OUT OF IT TIRED, so I said, yeh I know, just get the lights off & I was back to sleep. Only when I turned the lights on, yesterday evening, did I realize the WTF was not about the intertwine but about the fact that this plant was near death. In disbelief, I cut that one loose, & figure the best I can do, is flush it out & hope for a fucking miracle. Today, not a change, & I realized even if it did come back, yield would be incredibily reduced anyway. So, what happened? Bigger plant, FINE, doing as good as it always has.
Not sure if it is something at the soil level? Fulsarium Wilt? root rot? the factors all combined was too much stress for this one plant? I am amazed as I have ever been, for it to go from being weak but healthy overall & budding (or so it seemed) to every inch of the plant a droppy wilted mess, in less then 10 hours, is beyond me. I have wracked my brain & the ONLY other factor I haven't mentioned was in this weak plant, in the lowest portion of the stem, where I cut off one small branch & tried to twist it off, before cutting, it "seemed" as though this branch went through the entire main stem, & it seemed, although I thought that couldn't be, that when I twisted this branch, that I saw this branch actually move in a circle in this lower THICK trunck, & I was like no, it must have seemed that way. I quickly let go, as it wasn't twisting off as easy as I thought it would & I cut it. BUT...I still think, what if maybe I saw exactly what I thought I saw???
What if...this small stem I was removing moved in the center of this main trunk, then that would mean that could have effectively killed the plant, because that would have been the same as a bullet going through the trunk? I hope someone follows what I am saying, only the bullet was not pulled out, & there was no hole, nor is there in the trunk, but the damage would be the same.
If anyone has some thoughts, let me hear them. I probably have run every scenario or what it could have been through my mind anyway, but then again, maybe not. In any case, I would love if u can relate or anything similar has happened? In the meantime, when I feel like it, I will follow through with my own after death tests, lol, & will post some interesting pics; both which will be in my journal/journal post.
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okay, one plant is of my main flowering plants is 99% DEAD. I say 99%, because the only reason it isn't 100% dead is because I haven't the energy today to dig it up, check roots, crack stem, get soil samples, etc & then throw the damn thing in the trash, lol. So WHAT the hell happened? Well I am hoping to shed some light on that & hope after I do all of the above in the next day or two, I might have a clue. I am SO tired today & have a full schedule tomorrow, so probably won't get around to it until Monday. (Been busy the last few days, at the car auction, & wrapping everything up; just gave our 18 yr old her first car).
So this was (the good) thankfully the smallest & weaker of the 2 bigger plants, (the bad) but also the ONLY one I had used Uncle Ben's Topping Method on, & therefore will have NO results for this strain using it, nor comparing the end yield side by side with the untopped bigger healthier plant, FUCK ME! LOL. Damn that irks the shit out of me.
Okay, so I have known for at least the last 2-3 weeks, this plant was obviously not as strong, in spite of the natural fact it was about 4-6 days behind the other since seed, but because it was still not as flowered at it should have been, it was having issues, which I was attempting to address as what I expected was deficiencies & a bit of underwatering for a day or two. And the only difference between the 2 plants, other then a few days in age, was one was topped (now dead) & one was not, THRIVING still.
No matter what, I completely blame myself in the fact that regardless of what I found out, (if I do) to be the outcome of why this sucker died, I SHOULD have adjusted & flowered sooner, just to alleviate the pain in the ASS height restrictions I had FULL knowledge could occur. I knew the strain I was working with & know how this goes, yet I still chose to be bullheaded wanting to veg a full 60 days, to test the full yield potential (topped vs not), even though I KNEW the height could become my nemises, as it has.
So, this dead plant, bottom I'd say 1/4 of leaves started dropping alot about 2 weeks ago; first diagnosed from day or two of underwatering as when they shifted into overdrive wasn't aware already their intake had increased that much. SO...I thought it was from underwatering, yet, the other plant had no ill effect, which I attributed to it was stronger overalll, had always been the biggest/tallest from the start etc. & was not stressed from topping.
Then leaves started to yellow, drop off the plant or damn near, where a slight tug they'd come off, this happened on the bigger plant as well, but not as much. And on this dead plant, earlier on I felt there was more of a pronounced mag deficiency exhibited by new growth & yellower upper leaves. So I treated both the SAME way, as I figured both were bound to have the same defeiciency, even though only the one was showing more ill effects. Gave more mag via epsom salts, started giving nitrogen (along with my bloom ferts) because I am was quite certain I didn't give enough N in veg, because this plant (known in this strain to be sensitive to ferts) was given very little because after they showed the least little burn I backed WAY off; so of course I thought them being stronger now, no problem & being this strain flowers for approx. 67 days, knew what they had would not get them through without inhibiting the bud production to full potential.
I had a problem with the ph a little over about 2 weeks ago also, was too high & had been running high due to nute addage, so got some ph down. So flushed them, used ph down & continued on. Then again, about a week ago, used ph down, only this time, used too much, SHIT, so flushed them...but here was my real nucklehead move (and if you knew me u would know this is a RARE occassion, as I am blamed as being a perfectionist) so I flush them out, but was so tired (my exuse) right after I did, I use the SAME premixed water with TOO Much of the ph down I JUST used, & therefore u guessed it, FUCK...I had to flush them again. MORE work for me, highly frustrating, GRRRRR. Then ph down again. Now I will say on this weaker plant, it was still a little low after my 2 flushes (at about 5.5) but I was NOT about to flush again, figured next nute treatment would bring it up, & was tired. Amazingly it "seemed" this had no ill effect on either plant, & not proven yet that it did.
Okay, now weaker plant, still not looking much better almost 2 weeks later, lower leaves still droopy, yellowing not changed worse or better, time to get some calmag. Again treat both plants, this was probably on Wednesday. NOW...on Thursday, I finally decide, okay now that the bigger plant has made it to 1/4 inch in height above the bottom of my light & I don't have the height to lengthen the canopy either, I am going to have to bend my now flowering plants. So I quickly realize, with no side lighting to work with, the yield in both plants, especially the bigger one, is going to suffer if I don't get them both bent underneath the light. I also quickly realize that bending on towards the other is going to do 2 things: first, if I bend the big one over the smaller one I greatly decrease its bud potential. Second, the lower 3rd of both plants is going to receive virtually no light. So, here is what I did.
First I gently tied down the bigger plant, then I interwove the smaller plant in between the bigger one, tying it down, so it would be like a pair of hands, fingers folded together like in prayer, this way both the strongest budding topps receive adequate light. Then I trim off the lower 1/3 of the leaves & smaller branches; and I am someone who is never a proponent of doing so unless necessary (I hate hearing people prune healthy leaves) but I am not removing big fan leaves, simply smaller branches & leaves that aren't going to receive any light, nor in the weaker plant are doing great anyway. I figure in this case, this can only help each plant concentrate its energy on the healthy buds & 2/3 of the upper plant, both of which healthy.
Now, I did this during the lights on period (a couple hours after they came on) on Thursday evening, the next morning I awoke to hearing WTF, but I thought it was because the love of my life saw them intertwined, & I was OUT OF IT TIRED, so I said, yeh I know, just get the lights off & I was back to sleep. Only when I turned the lights on, yesterday evening, did I realize the WTF was not about the intertwine but about the fact that this plant was near death. In disbelief, I cut that one loose, & figure the best I can do, is flush it out & hope for a fucking miracle. Today, not a change, & I realized even if it did come back, yield would be incredibily reduced anyway. So, what happened? Bigger plant, FINE, doing as good as it always has.
Not sure if it is something at the soil level? Fulsarium Wilt? root rot? the factors all combined was too much stress for this one plant? I am amazed as I have ever been, for it to go from being weak but healthy overall & budding (or so it seemed) to every inch of the plant a droppy wilted mess, in less then 10 hours, is beyond me. I have wracked my brain & the ONLY other factor I haven't mentioned was in this weak plant, in the lowest portion of the stem, where I cut off one small branch & tried to twist it off, before cutting, it "seemed" as though this branch went through the entire main stem, & it seemed, although I thought that couldn't be, that when I twisted this branch, that I saw this branch actually move in a circle in this lower THICK trunck, & I was like no, it must have seemed that way. I quickly let go, as it wasn't twisting off as easy as I thought it would & I cut it. BUT...I still think, what if maybe I saw exactly what I thought I saw???
What if...this small stem I was removing moved in the center of this main trunk, then that would mean that could have effectively killed the plant, because that would have been the same as a bullet going through the trunk? I hope someone follows what I am saying, only the bullet was not pulled out, & there was no hole, nor is there in the trunk, but the damage would be the same.
If anyone has some thoughts, let me hear them. I probably have run every scenario or what it could have been through my mind anyway, but then again, maybe not. In any case, I would love if u can relate or anything similar has happened? In the meantime, when I feel like it, I will follow through with my own after death tests, lol, & will post some interesting pics; both which will be in my journal/journal post.
