Originally Posted by MOBee

If you cant afford AN dont spam people post. the guy asked what to get, either answer him or go get laid.

Originally Posted by fatman7574

I am not just into the cheapest available nutrients , but I am into just paying a reasonable price for a like product. I am not into paying triple or even twenty times the cost of producing a nutrient just to get a name brand when a identical product can be bought for less, or when I can simply mix it myself. That much is true.

At worse a good software package for formulating aeroponic/hydroponic or soil medium nutrients is sold world wide fron New Zealand for about $130 U.S. funds. That is a very easily recouped amount considering the low cost of the base fertilizers and chemicals use in mixing nutrients.

I am also not into the marketing hype that a product is better because they claim a better supplier of raw chemicals, (what a joke) or because they merely say their formula is better. AN as do their equal competitors very, very likely buy from the same sources if the are based in the same general area and also buy the same purity classification of chemicals as their competitors which is evident by way of analysis of the final products. There are just to many governent policies that have limited the numv bers of producers of products and there are just so many economical methods to refine those chemicals so the better chemicals story is chiefly marketing hype and the measurements of very n minute amounts of trace elements that differ from one source to another. Those amounts are definitely inconsequential or negligible to all but a pitching marketer.

When an analysis of that better product merely amounts to an increase or decrease of a major nutrient by 0.1 percent, that is not an improved formula or improved products used in production but merely minor formulation changes so as to say their product is different or better. That is just another game of the high dollar nutrient suppliers. It is merely unethical marketing and such policies are known or even originate from the top of those corporations. That is sad and happens frquently.

There are no scientific avantages held by one company over another. There are no secrets, no major advances or discoveries or unknowns to anyone but to the customers who do not have the ability to analylize the products. However, the majority of those products can be easily tested at anyones local university as nearly all of them have cooperative extension services where such tests are done free or for just few dollars.

The thing is I do independently test many of the retail marketed products as do many others. I have table tops and shelves covered with analytical chemistry/laboratory test equipment in my home, and as well as more sophisticated pieces of test equipment available to me at the University. The test equipment doesn' t lie and the field tests done by many, including myself, have clearly and repeatedly shown like analysis products merely provide like results regardless of the name on the label or the retail cost.

It is just the pits especially when you find companies selling things like Pythoff products that are merely a very dilute solution of RO water and chlorine bleach. Then there are the many other rip offs like the silica phopsphate solutions, the pH up and pH down products . And people buy that stuff at high prices. The nutrient market is no better but possibly worse.

I have yet to see any of the manafacturers of quality aeroponic/hydroponic nutrients just do something sensible like send you two packets of chemicals Part A and Part B, and simply tell you to pour one of each packets into a one gallon bottle and add RO water until full, them mix, to make 100X concentrates. They could very easily do that for a few dollars a packet and still make a profit. That would even take away their use of feeble excuses of high manafacturing costs such as: bottling, labeling, packaging and shipping when trying to claim a just reason for their extremely high prices.

In other hobbies such as reef keeping bussinesses set up just to sell bulk supplies such as chemicals because they saw that people were being badly ripped off. There you buy packages of supplement chemicals, and just add them to RO water. Duh. Or they will sell you just about every other major product used in bulk at greatly reduced costs. I think someone ought to do the same for growers. Let AN and like manafacturers find legitimate/ethical ways to make money rather than taking advantage of Pot growers. Commercial growers of other products don't touch AN's products or their counter parts products. They merely mix there own for 1/10 the cost or less. Simple as that.

Originally Posted by fatman7574

I can afford any thing I choose to buy. I answered with my honest opinion, not spam. You however have contributed nothing what so ever.

Originally Posted by redi jedi

Tell you what...how bout you mix me up a nute cocktail of your own (since you have access to all the equipment to do so) and I'll try it out and let you know if its as good, better or worse than those horrible conspirators(LOL) at AN?..Put up or shut up...

Originally Posted by fatman7574

It only takes a scale and some intellegence to mix up a given formulation. I could send you formulations (recipies)showing the exact amounts of fertilizers and chemicals (miconutrients) to mix just about any of the major manafacturer's regular product lines. I will only seend such information in a PM as I will not post it on an open forum. What is done with that information is up to the receiver.


Say the recipies for GH Micro, Bloom, Grow, and Hard Water Micro.

However, as you are being just a jerk off, I will send it instead to another more cordial poster that has asked for help. If he choses to share the information with you that is on him, not me.

Originally Posted by squarepush3r

maybe you could post a tutorial, with pictures, on how to mix your own nut's? That would really cool, and totally legal I think! Of course you don't have to reveal exact manufactures levels, since that may involve copyright or something. I'd like to mix my own nut's.

So I need a vent hood, or other chemistry safety supplies?

Originally Posted by fatman7574

No special equipment needed except a scale. The recipe sent to you by PM is for GH MICRO and Bloom combined into a standard two part formulation. It is a 100X concentration recipe for 5 gallons of concentrate. I would wear latex gloves while handling the chemicals.

Originally Posted by GreenThumbSucker

This might come in handy

For formulating your own recipes.

Originally Posted by fatman7574

Yes that is a good basic program. It does not do conversions from a standard percentage analysis to ppm's, and U.S. nutrient manafacturers are only required to list analysis percentages not ppm's. Nor does it sepearte the formulas into two or three part formulas, or tell you when you have exceeded levels and will therefore have precipitation etc.

However, the unethical manafacturers even avoid disclosing analysis percentages also when ever they can find a way. Or they post the data then close the site url's to the info. But if you have enough understanding to know standard ppms commonly used you would likely also know enough to not waste your money of premixed nutrients like AN anyway so their analysis would matter little to you anyway. I think MaxiBllom is selling for about $15 for 2.2 pounds. http://www.ecogrow.com/index.cfm/pro...d/40/home.html I think I can easily buy the ingrediants for 16 pounds for about 8 dollars.