First Ever for GardensGrow in the
The Grow Room forums; Current Phase : Grow room construction and testing
High temperatures (86 - 88 degrees) Measures Taken:
Moved ballast ...
First Ever for GardensGrow
Current Phase: Grow room construction and testing
High temperatures (86 - 88 degrees)
- Moved ballast outside closet
- Positioned filter into more optimal location
- Purchased air cooled hood (in transit)
- Placed piece of cardboard over thermometer to ensure reading was for "air temp" and not "radiant temp"
Further Possible Improvements:
- Replace 4" fan with 6" fan
I'm finding myself in an interesting situation: I haven't smoked for about three years and the other day I decided that I wanted to try it again. Not wanting to deal with the usual myriad of dealers, inflated prices, and so-so quality I decided that it was time to grow my own.
After a bit of research on here and various other websites I decided to turn my closet into a grow room. The specs were just right for a personal sized grow (plus maybe a little extra for friends) at 4' x 2' x 8'.
I was debating on what medium to grow in when I took a trip home the other day and my father was practically standing there with an EarthBox in his hands. Personally seeing the amazing results with tomatoes that these things produce I decided to give it a try.
Next on the list was to purchase seeds since I've heard those take a while to arrive; I figure I have a month to get the grow chamber ready to go. I purchased NL99 from Joey Weed (through hempdepot.ca) for the low odor characteristics and decent price.
A quick visit to HTG sent me into the red for this month when I purchased a 400 watt MH & HPS system, coupled with a 170 cfm blower and carbon filter.
At this point in time I've got the lighting system set up (minus chains at the moment) and the fan exhausting into my attic. A one hour test run with the MH bulb, the blower running, and an oscillating fan left my room at 86 degrees.
Which brings me to now...how to get the temp down?
This will be a cooperative journal so feel free to post comments, questions, and suggestions.
Thanks for lookin!
Here is the basic set up right now (minus the EarthBox):
Last edited by GardensGrow; 06-12-2008 at 10:11 PM.
Running the ballast outside the grow area will be your best move. It creates as much or more heat than the bulb.
Since your fixture is open-air, you need to direct the end of the ducting as close to the heat source as possible - in this case the bulb. Either route it around the front of the shelf if you can, or put a hole in the shelf and run it through so that it sucks horizontally from the bulb fixture. You can rig something up.
just wanna say for someone just jumpin into it your set up looks good. for less heat i would second the removal of the ballas from the area at least put it up top around the exhaust fan or something. maybe get a bigger fan. good luck on the grow. hope you get your seeds soon. i got mine less 2 weeks through doc chronic, and didnt get em through nirvana, if your in US its a bit of a crap shoot.
Hey thanks guys. I asked about this issue in another thread before I decided to start a grow journal and someone else suggested re-routing the filter/ducting too.
As for the ballast, I was hoping to keep this semi-stealth but with the giant beacon of light coming from underneath the door I think that putting the ballast outside will be the least of my worries.
So I will do both, check temps, snap pics, and post.
Can you get your intake air from somewhere else? You're going to need to seal off that door when you flower. During the dark period it's suppose to be completely dark--no light leaks. If light leaks in they'll be reluctant to start flowering and they could even turn into hermaphrodites (so I'm told).
In my situation I build a cabinet that houses my grow. And the cabinet sits in a closet. It would have been easier to just use the closet itself as the grow space but I didn't have a good way to seal it from light leaks AND keep it looking like a normal closet. It was fine as-is for vegging but I needed the cab for flowering.
FWIW, I'm using a 6" 440cfm fan (with an extraordinary long duct run--about 50 feet of mostly rigid duct), an air cooled hood, a DIY carbon scrubber, and a 250w HID. I believe I've lost at least half the rated cfm of my fan (hard to judge). I also have a cheapy humidifier blowing directly into the grow area through some ducting. That helped bring temps down and raise my humidity to 35-40% (dry climate). My temps are 2.5deg above ambient (typically 80 minus 77.5 but the spread holds at slightly lower temps) ~8" below the bulb . Without the humidifier I believe my temp spread was more like 4, perhaps 5 degrees. My cab is actually a functional prototype that needs some tweaking so I think the final setup will improve the temp spreads. The final version will be a complete rebuild out of permanent materials, a real door instead of a sliding piece of cardboard, etc.
The first pic doesn't really show the whole current setup but might give you an idea of what I'm working with. The second and third pics are from before I got the cab prototype installed. With the pre-cab arrangement my temps where 1 degree or less above ambient. Also, that filter you see lasted about a week before it had to go. I've got a different one now that's more substantial (and restrictive).
My goal is to have enough cooling capacity to accommodate a 400w with no more than a 3 degree temp spread. And I'd like to accomplish that without needing the humidifier when the lights are on. I think I can do that but it's likely going to take the addition of another 6" fan. Dual exhaust fans where part of the original plan (even though I've only got one right now) so I'm ok with that. So much fan probably wouldn't be necessary for most but my exhaust fan(s) are really far away up in the attic (stealth!). Long runs means loss in cfm. Sorry for rambling but your situation reminds me a bit of mine.
Last edited by Hawk; 06-10-2008 at 01:18 PM.
I can't really get the intake from anywhere else unfortunately. I rent the property so minimal destruction is best. Altough I've considered buying a cheap door so I can beat on it...
I've got to admit that it's slightly discouraging to see that you're using a 6" 440cfm with a 250 watt and you're at 2 degrees above ambient (you're setup is awesome btw). Considering I'm at 170cfm with a 400 watt I'm thinkin' I've got quite the challenge ahead of me lol. Humidity isn't much of an issue here at the moment. How exactly does humidity affect temperature? Seems like it lowers the temp a bit...
As we speak I'm re-testing the grow cab after moving the ballast out of the room and re-positioning the filter directly above the light. I will post temps and pictures after it's all finished.
Don't let my setup or results discourage you. My super long duct run hurts the actual cfm being moved by my fan, not doubt about that. And I've read plenty of opinions stating it's not that much harder to cool a 400w vs. a 250w. I must admit I've always read those comments with skepticism--but heck, I don't really know. I'd just keep tweaking your setup looking for incremental improvements. Move things around, add some circulation fans, get the ballast out--I bet it will add up and you'll start getting close.
I experimented with a speed controller on my exhaust fan before I remotely located it into my attic. I found that it didn't take much airflow through the hood (WAY less than full speed) to keep the hood pretty cool. The speed controller made my fan loud as heck though. Plus I want/need as many cfm as possible to rotate fresh air into the grow area. So I run it full speed. But that might mean that if you can suck air from very close to your hood it might make a big difference.
Another option is to make a DIY cooltube as an alternative to purchasing an air cooled hood.
About the door: I do think the larger your passive intake is the closer you'll get to the actual CFM rating of your fan. But 1" by 30" (?) is 30 square inches. That's not too bad in relation to your 4" diameter fan. I bet you can figure a way to light proof it too. I'm thinking a cardboard light-trap contraption could work.
The humidifier does help bring down temps. Last time I stuck my temp probe right into the outlet of the humidifier I believe the air was colder than I was expecting. 68deg if I recall (not many cfm's though). It's basically a little swamp cooler if you're familiar with those (a common item in the desert).
your ducting looks like a curley-q right now, which i'm sure hurts flow.
first, i would put the filter intake at the same level as the light, so you can adjust it with the chain as you move the light, and so the air flow is actually over the light. currently, air has to flow around the entire hood to get to the intake, which is slow compared to creating a flow over it. if you then either cut the ducting or compress it, you'll end up with less effective ducting, and in the shape of something like a "C" or an upside-down question mark, if you get me.
Hey thanks ceestyle. I've got the filter hooked up right now that's it's adjustable but I think you're absolutely right about the position and the ducting shape.
Are you thinking that the filter should run parallel to the light (assuming the current setup is perpendicular)?
If parallel I think it might fit behind the light but it might block light and touch the wall (creating less flow). If I keep it perpendicular I would place it to the left of the light. Any suggestions on location? I guess I can try each way and see what kind of temps I get; except changing it all is a pain in the ass lol.
Lastly, how do people mount these fans? All I got were two screws that don't do a damn thing in the way of securing the fan to the provided bracket. If I could get that fan running in a vertical position (and lifted about a foot above the shelf) I could reduce the ducting drastically.
Tags for this Thread