Tis the season: bubblelicious and superskunk 400W grow

Okay team, tis the season south of the Mason-Dixon line for indoor, unless you like getting eaten out of house and home by AC bills..

Set up six pots this weekend - 1 inch of sand in the bottom for drainage. Then filled with MG standard potting soil, and mixed in 2tbs of lime per gallon (2 gal pots).

This year, for a twist, I hollowed out a 4-5" round area in the center of the pot and filled it with seed starter mix. This is so the seedlings won't encounter "hot soil" early in the grow. Thus, I'm hoping to avoid the nute shock that all growers using pre-ferted soils seem to go through early on. I'll let you know how that goes.

Germ'ed 3 each of superskunk and bubblelicious from NirvanaShop. Overnight in water at 85F. They all looked plump and ready; a couple had rootlets out already. They're in the pots now in my warm, humid bathroom with just ambient outside light. Worked great last year - don't mess with success.

They'll go under 400W metal halide once they're up for a couple days.

Pic's to come; nothing really to look at just yet.

Here we are -- day 5. These little guys took barely two days to go from hitting the soil, to being up and running. I gave them 3 days in the gentle environ of my bathroom, then moved them under the MH yesterday (400W).

As you'll see, I like things simple. Simple as possible. I've gone from nationally ranked triathlete to laziest ass ever over the course of life.

If you want fancy nute regimes, clever soil mixes, impressive light banks and such, you're in the wrong place. If you want to see a half-pound of high grade churned out from a $200 light and $20 worth of supplies, well... that's the goal. Hit 11 zips last time..

So far, so good. Temp at 76F - perfect. The combination of southern winter+400W light+cheap-built tract home equals perfect temps until late Mar or so. Stems are nice and stiff so far.

I made those white panels with $8 worth of wood, and flat white paint I had around.

The last pic is one of the superskunks born with one cotyledon - first time I've seen that.

All is well; not much use in more seedling pic's at this point.

The only thing I'm really doing right now is misting twice a day -- the MH really draws the water out of the top inch or two of soil, while the bottom stays very moist. This is how I think a lot of people get into overwatering trouble -- the top of the pot and soil looks like a desert, when the bottom is a swamp.

Some genetic variation coming thru in the Bubblelicious. All the previous Bubs I've grown were very short, stout, and deep deep green with purple stems out of the seed. This time, only one of the three shows this characteristic. The other two are kinda stretchy and lighter green, closer in looks to my sativa bagseeds from the last grow (but I KNOW I didn't mix anything up). Weird. And I don't like it. It means energy going into the top when it should go into roots, and it means flopping over and pissing me off, and having to prop them up (well, one of 'em... the other is still standing on its own).

The superskunks are interesting - first time I've grown them. Lighter colored, almost lime-green. All three very consistent with each other so far. Very stout in the stem, which is nice. I hate that flop-over shit.

Also, I found ONE LAST BOWL of superskunk in a corner of a forgotten baggie I had from last year and smoked it. YUM!!! Man, I love that shit. Really happy to be growing it.

Post away if you want; not the most exciting thing going on here, I know..

Kriegs said:

All is well; not much use in more seedling pic's at this point.

The only thing I'm really doing right now is misting twice a day -- the MH really draws the water out of the top inch or two of soil, while the bottom stays very moist. This is how I think a lot of people get into overwatering trouble -- the top of the pot and soil looks like a desert, when the bottom is a swamp.

Some genetic variation coming thru in the Bubblelicious. All the previous Bubs I've grown were very short, stout, and deep deep green with purple stems out of the seed. This time, only one of the three shows this characteristic. The other two are kinda stretchy and lighter green, closer in looks to my sativa bagseeds from the last grow (but I KNOW I didn't mix anything up). Weird. And I don't like it. It means energy going into the top when it should go into roots, and it means flopping over and pissing me off, and having to prop them up (well, one of 'em... the other is still standing on its own).

The superskunks are interesting - first time I've grown them. Lighter colored, almost lime-green. All three very consistent with each other so far. Very stout in the stem, which is nice. I hate that flop-over shit.

Also, I found ONE LAST BOWL of superskunk in a corner of a forgotten baggie I had from last year and smoked it. YUM!!! Man, I love that shit. Really happy to be growing it.

Post away if you want; not the most exciting thing going on here, I know..

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Actually, bro, I think that anyone that is growing under your variables that can whip out 11oz of decent nug is doing a damn fine job. As UB likes to say, keep it simple. So, I'm anticipating future updates to pick up some tips. I also use a 400W light, only I paid a hundred more than you did from some kid that had some never used Hydrofarm equipment. 400 W MH Ace conversion, and a 430 W super HPS.... To the point: I know you stated that you were a little concerned w/ regard to the stretching of your Bub. IMHO, I believe that you are getting a little stretch, maybe not necessarily due to some kind of phenotypic expression, but rather the fact that your MH looks as if it's more than 2-2.5 ft away. I know you don't want to stress them (ie, light and temp), which is why you've put some distance between the seedlings. However, at around 2.5 ft you are only getting about 6000-12000 lumens if your light is rated at 35000-55000 lumens.That is why it's ideal to use fluorescents for this stage of growth... you can put light 2 inches away and prevent stretching. I would consider lowering your light a bit more, given that they handle it well. I didn't see your previous grow (if you even posted it), but the you can move 400W lights as close as 12 inches, possibly closer if they're cooled. I'm in week 4 of flowering and my colas are about 8inches away w/ zero burning in similar temps and 45-50% RH.

Who knows, I'm probably giving my 2 cents where its not needed. You prob know all this shit if your able to get the yield you did. Just thought I would try to throw a little knowledge your way. Look forward to seeing these progress. Cheers!

dakin3d said:

Who knows, I'm probably giving my 2 cents where its not needed. You prob know all this shit if your able to get the yield you did. Just thought I would try to throw a little knowledge your way. Look forward to seeing these progress. Cheers!

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Not at all! Thanks for the input. I was pretty aggressive keeping my light close when my plants got up a bit last time. I guess I was just being a little overly conservative with seedlings.

But yeah, I'll def drop the light down a bit...

Checked the light last night and actually, it's only 16" above the pots (the photo angle makes it seem more), and it's just that one plant that's stretched out and floppy. The rest are nice and firm. I think I'll just let it ride for now.

If another flops, I'll reconsider.

Otherwise, all is well and the second set of leaves are lifting away from the node on most of them now. Should be fledged out by the end of the week. More pics by then, at least.

Last time, that's when the growth really took off; hope for a repeat.

Kriegs said:

Checked the light last night and actually, it's only 16" above the pots (the photo angle makes it seem more), and it's just that one plant that's stretched out and floppy. The rest are nice and firm. I think I'll just let it ride for now.

If another flops, I'll reconsider.

Otherwise, all is well and the second set of leaves are lifting away from the node on most of them now. Should be fledged out by the end of the week. More pics by then, at least.

Last time, that's when the growth really took off; hope for a repeat.

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Ah, definitely let it ride, bro. The pic does make it look like its further away, which is why I hate making assumptions and still made the mistake of doing so! At 16" you should be getting at least 14K lumens or more to them, depending on the brand of 400W light... Obviously more than enough. Don't know what that equates to in PAR, but it should be sufficient considering the size.

Also, I know you like to keep it simple, but I thought I would share this anyway, being that I think that it's pretty amazing. I am currently working at a local hydro store in my area. There is a product on the market that actually inhibits plant stretching and keeps the plant from growing vertically, so that you are left w/ a short bushy frame. I assume it's either a hormone based product, or something that inhibits vertical tissue production w/o altering the overall integrity of the plant. I can get you the details if your interested, but they won't disclose the 'recipe'. Obviously, something they want to keep exclusive at the current time.

Looking forward to the pics... Cheers!

dakin3d said:

Ah, definitely let it ride, bro. The pic does make it look like its further away, which is why I hate making assumptions and still made the mistake of doing so! At 16" you should be getting at least 14K lumens or more to them, depending on the brand of 400W light... Obviously more than enough. Don't know what that equates to in PAR, but it should be sufficient considering the size.

Also, I know you like to keep it simple, but I thought I would share this anyway, being that I think that it's pretty amazing. I am currently working at a local hydro store in my area. There is a product on the market that actually inhibits plant stretching and keeps the plant from growing vertically, so that you are left w/ a short bushy frame. I assume it's either a hormone based product, or something that inhibits vertical tissue production w/o altering the overall integrity of the plant. I can get you the details if your interested, but they won't disclose the 'recipe'. Obviously, something they want to keep exclusive at the current time.

Looking forward to the pics... Cheers!

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I think what you're talking about is "Bushmaster"? If that's right, I believe the idea of that is to inhibit stretching when you go 12/12 ('course, maybe you're talking about a different product).

I don't like going into hydro stores where I'm at. A buddy of mine got traced from one in Alabama and got busted. Cops watch those places in states where growing MJ is completely illegal. 'Course, there's the 'net, too.

Not sure if thats it or not... I'm pretty sure that this supplement is used during both growth stages but not definitively sure. Sounds like I needed some 'Bushmaster' for my current (1st) grow, though. For only having a 430W HPS, my plants are way too big! Over 4 ft. now... I've tried to lollipop somewhat, but I waited too long to do so, so I didn't want to stress the plant out too much by trimming large amounts.

Damn, man, I can't believe that the hydro shop was a primary source for them... That def concerns me. I'm not too far away from AL, not far at all! Was he growing in volume? Yeah, but if they're trying to get at you online, I believe it has to be some serious shit... But what do I know. Hope all is well, bro.

dakin3d said:

Yeah, but if they're trying to get at you online, I believe it has to be some serious shit... But what do I know. Hope all is well, bro.

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By "'Course, there's always the 'net", I meant I could always order hydro stuff on the 'net without fear of being scoped in a hydro-store parking lot.

Didn't mean to freak you out.. sorry!

My friend in AL had one 1000W, about 10 plants under it. They not only busted him and took the plants, but they trashed the room and his gear in the process. Very scary. Pigs probably took his plants home and trimmed them up and hung 'em for their stashes, if you ask me.

Okay.. the little buggers are doing well. As you can see, the second set of leaves are starting to separate away from the node on most of the plants.

Last year, this was when my babes REALLY took off growth wise.

The first two pic's are the bubblelicious; the next two are superskunk. The blurry one is the superskunk born with one cotyledon. It replaced the other cotyledon with a single true leaf - weird. It's some kind of mutant; hopefully in a good way.

The little cardboard prop is my virtually-free solution to "seedling flop". Just bracing them this way keeps them going and if you look closely, you can see the plant starting to pull itself up. Did this last year -- works great.

I watered Monday evening for the first time; just enough to wet the "cool core" area in the center, not enough to cause nutrient bleed from the surrounding hot soil. Still misting the soil top regularly, like 2X a day to slow the drying from the light.

Been a little warmer here lately, so the room has been, too. Like 82-84F. Last year, I started out in a closet and it was hitting mid-90's regularly, so no worries about low 80's.

Not much happening other than growth. Metered the pots last night and found the lower level of the soil to be drying down; getting light to the feel, too. Watered this morning when the light came on.

Ms Floppy is still flopping, but her leaves look good and I'm sure she'll firm up.

Flop will be no prob, like you said she'll firm up. Just as little movement as possible while she tries. Once roots are better developed, it wouldn't be a bad idea to supplement w/ some CalMag, or something similar in content. The reason being, soft stems can be a secondary or micro-nutrient deficiency, but I doubt it will continue. FYI, I like to use a toothpick for 'staking' seedlings, if need be. Although, if your 'support' is working, it should be more than sufficient. I actually thought that the cardboard was support was brilliant. Simple, yet innovative, always is!

They are looking good. I will be interested to see the next set of pics. Like you said, they should start to roll at this stage. I did want to ask, what light cycle are you using currently? 20/4, I assume? I think that during seedling stage, you can definitely go 24/0, but that's just my opinion. 2 reasons: They're starving for light. I understand that small plants only need only so much light, but in my opinion this only refers to concentration, NOT duration. Seedlings can use 24/0 (early-late vegetative stage, different story). Second, it helps dry the soil. From my experience, it's never been beneficial for soil to stay constantly wet/damp for longer than a day. Leaving the light on 24/0 during seedling stage can aid in 'drying' the moisture that remains behind which isn't immediately utilized aiding in oxygen availability temporarily. Remember, you'll be watering the next day to maintain tissue development and viability. Tell me your thoughts...

I still haven't been into the hydro shop, as im off til after the break (part-time). My boy who works there, still hasn't gotten back to me to let me know what that product is called, but im pretty sure it was different that what you initially thought. Not that it matters, but now it's just bothering me!

Btw, how much experience do you have in taking clones? Talk soon

Subbed - flowering both super skunk and bubblelicious currently.

dakin3d said:

Flop will be no prob, like you said she'll firm up.

I did want to ask, what light cycle are you using currently? 20/4, I assume?

Btw, how much experience do you have in taking clones? Talk soon

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It looks like that plant is firming up -- been standing on its own for a couple days although the supports are still there if she wavers.

I'm on 18/6 right now; I know it could go more but my SO pays the light bill, so this is the compromise. I agree with you, though, on the nice effect the light has in dissipating excess moisture - that cuts off a lot of problems (molds, fungi, gnats, etc.). I still get that on 18/6.

I have ZERO experience with clones - this is just my second grow. But this may be the year to do that -- I'll see how many fems I end up with (and therefore, how much room I have).

I'm planning to take some more pics tonight -- there's been enough growth now to warrant new pics.

Everything is rolling along; no real problems. I swapped sides, moving the superskunks to the weaker side of the light (my light power is a little skewed -- full power is not dead-center under the lamp).

I made the move as my superskunks were showing some light stress - tiny necrotic patches that I recognize as light burn. No big deal - it's concentrated on the first true leaves. They're coming out of the seedling stage quickly, so they should pass thru this. No such problem with bubblelicious - they love it and say "give me more..."

Fascinating, though, the diff's between strains. Superskunk must be pretty well selected to the indoor environment, seeing as a 400W is about 1/5 the strength of the natural sun, according to my light meter. I think next time, I will deploy a rack of flourescents for this early stage of growth.

I'll take pic's tonight...

Bob Smith said:

Subbed - flowering both super skunk and bubblelicious currently.

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Sweet.. thanks for joining.

I'm in a time-crush at work right now, but I will def check out your links later!

I'm excited to see how these two strains do together as a "team" -- they seem very compatible by all descriptions.

Kriegs said:

Everything is rolling along; no real problems. I swapped sides, moving the superskunks to the weaker side of the light (my light power is a little skewed -- full power is not dead-center under the lamp).

I made the move as my superskunks were showing some light stress - tiny necrotic patches that I recognize as light burn. No big deal - it's concentrated on the first true leaves. They're coming out of the seedling stage quickly, so they should pass thru this. No such problem with bubblelicious - they love it and say "give me more..."

Fascinating, though, the diff's between strains. Superskunk must be pretty well selected to the indoor environment, seeing as a 400W is about 1/5 the strength of the natural sun, according to my light meter. I think next time, I will deploy a rack of flourescents for this early stage of growth.

I'll take pic's tonight...

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Interesting - I'm growing SS, BL, and New York Power Diesel, and the Super Skunk were by far the most vigorous, with the NYPD next, and the BL being the least vigorous.

This is getting interesting.........

Took a closer look at the superskunks -- got little necrotic tips. They're just not happy with the arrangement at all. They've adjusted to the light, but now the tips... they don't like the soil either. Not really a nute burn (I know what that looks like..); more like a salt burn.

Sorry, no pics right now - left my camera at work and I won't be back there at all until Jan 4; so that's another issue.

Had four plants run into issues with pre-ferted soil last year. One came out great; the other three went male. I think theres' something to the "stress=male" theory. I've got 4 trains of thought right now.

1. Ride it out...
2. Water heavier to move any potential salts down the soil column (shouldn't be an issue already..)
3. Transplant them into a quality unferted soil
4. Pop a couple of new beans and put them in a better soil; let these ride as they are..

I'll mull on it overnight. Any thoughts appreciated.

Two of the bubblelicious look great; the other a little stressed itself. This sucks right now...

Kriegs said:

Took a closer look at the superskunks -- got little necrotic tips. They're just not happy with the arrangement at all. They've adjusted to the light, but now the tips... they don't like the soil either. Not really a nute burn (I know what that looks like..); more like a salt burn.

Sorry, no pics right now - left my camera at work and I won't be back there at all until Jan 4; so that's another issue.

Had four plants run into issues with pre-ferted soil last year. One came out great; the other three went male. I think theres' something to the "stress=male" theory. I've got 4 trains of thought right now.

1. Ride it out...
2. Water heavier to move any potential salts down the soil column (shouldn't be an issue already..)
3. Transplant them into a quality unferted soil
4. Pop a couple of new beans and put them in a better soil; let these ride as they are..

I'll mull on it overnight. Any thoughts appreciated.

Two of the bubblelicious look great; the other a little stressed itself. This sucks right now...

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Generally "1" is your best bet.

See if the plants can sort themselves out for a few days, and if they appear to be getting worse, then take action.

Just my $.02.