Spend my money, all blues or diamond series?

[fossil22]

Which model Advanced compared to which model Penetrator? I mean if we are talking "this light will work" then we would have never had advancement in lighting, or weed for that matter.
Look guys, all Im saying is that there is better for your $ out there and to try and stay as educated and as far ahead as you can when purchasing new technology, if your not willing to do your research, or your satisfied with "this will work" stuff, then Im not sure why you ask people for their opinions and then tear them apart without even trying to back it up with something other than this 40 yr old dude I know.
Im 44 btw, not sure why it matters....
Gah! Nvm, Im getting tired of this thread, Im gonna go smoke a bowl and enjoy the rest of my day....

 

[anotherdaymusic]

Which model Advanced compared to which model Penetrator? I mean if we are talking "this light will work" then we would have never had advancement in lighting, or weed for that matter.
Look guys, all Im saying is that there is better for your $ out there and to try and stay as educated and as far ahead as you can when purchasing new technology, if your not willing to do your research, or your satisfied with "this will work" stuff, then Im not sure why you ask people for their opinions and then tear them apart without even trying to back it up with something other than this 40 yr old dude I know.
Im 44 btw, not sure why it matters....
Gah! Nvm, Im getting tired of this thread, Im gonna go smoke a bowl and enjoy the rest of my day....

Probably the reason why you got a negative response is because you told someone who already uses them that they were junk and to not "waste their time," it just comes off as slightly disrespectful and you will def get a rebuttal. Nobody really needs to come on here and argue, and thats not really what the thread was about. It was about specific led's... penetrators are great, advanced are great, blackstars are pretty cool. Id really like to do a side by side experiment on all of the new led's so we can just once and for all find the cream of the crop. But from actual draw power, the penetrator and the advanced aren't much different. They are both great american made panels. And remember again, this is for a veg cab not a flowering cab.

 

[Beefbisquit]

I would suggest doing a little more research on LEDs before you pull the trigger on another light. Blackstars are junk, the light panels you buy from Ebay are junk, Advanced uses a generic lens which is better, but is still behind in technology and uses a standard spectrum, I also think that packing the lights so close together creates heat which speeds up deterioration.. Check out Apache, Haight, or Hydro-Grow for an actual LED light that works well and will actually last. LEDs are getting bad raps because of all the junk and poor designs that are out there right now, but LEDs ARE the future. Plasmas provide an adjustable spectrum, but uses more elec and are too expensive and dont last as long, old school HPS uses too much electricity not to mention you have to vent for heat control, replace bulbs and you still only have a limited spectrum. Im using a Hydro-Grow Penatrator Pro (a little more expensive than the Advanced) and its working better than my 600W HPS ever did and I never have to turn on the A/C as the light runs at no more than 90 degrees, not to mention it only uses around 200w total with a Par output that equals if not surpasses my 600W HPS. They use an advanced spectrum, an optcial grade PMMA Acrylic lens, and run the diodes at far less than rated for longer life and less emission deterioration and the light is of modular design, so if anything goes wrong, they can just send you a replacement part and your light is never fully down, which would be a huge problem for most of us. Oh, did I mention the advanced spectrum provided me with a lightning fast Veg, AND is flowering better than my HPS did with no switch?? Honestly, who wants to replace a light with a bunch of other lights?? Get a GOOD LED and dont waste your money on multiple lights, it kind of defeats the purpose of going LED..

Ohh man.... there are a ton of grow journals that would disagree that Blackstars are "junk". Are there better LED lighting systems? You bet, but for the price you can't beat them.

I'd put $1500 worth of Blackstars up against $1500 of penetrator power any day, all day, everyday.


You are also using watts and amperage interchangeably which isn't correct. Watts is the power used, (W=I x V). mA is milliamps, 1000mA in one ampere, or amp (I=V/R).

To do the calculations we are missing a variable, either the resistance or the voltage that each diode is driven at.

 

[anotherdaymusic]

Ohh man.... there are a ton of grow journals that would disagree that Blackstars are "junk". Are there better LED lighting systems? You bet, but for the price you can't beat them.

I'd put $1500 worth of Blackstars up against $1500 of penetrator power any day, all day, everyday.


You are also using watts and amperage interchangeably which isn't correct. Watts is the power used, (W=I x V). mA is milliamps, 1000mA in one ampere, or amp (I=V/R).

To do the calculations we are missing a variable, either the resistance or the voltage that each diode is driven at.

Ive checked in on your journal and your blackstars are rockin man. Id agree with you, I know blackstars are not junk. And I know the diamond series is not junk at all as well.

 

[Sc0rpi043]

Which model Advanced compared to which model Penetrator? I mean if we are talking "this light will work" then we would have never had advancement in lighting, or weed for that matter.
Look guys, all Im saying is that there is better for your $ out there and to try and stay as educated and as far ahead as you can when purchasing new technology, if your not willing to do your research, or your satisfied with "this will work" stuff, then Im not sure why you ask people for their opinions and then tear them apart without even trying to back it up with something other than this 40 yr old dude I know.
Im 44 btw, not sure why it matters....
Gah! Nvm, Im getting tired of this thread, Im gonna go smoke a bowl and enjoy the rest of my day....

Fossil, thanks for your thoughts

Have you looked at Irishboy's journals by chance? He's used the penetrator in the past ( prob and older model which i agree does matter) and apparently thinks the 2011 Spectra's are the best out currently so much hes actually said they are too powerful if you don't watch - he has to be mindful of burning and bleaching. I know your co-op just threw down alot of cash but I thought you might find it a good read.

 

[Sc0rpi043]

So I've heard it both ways.

1. Whether veg or flower all spectrums is optimal
1b. Whether veg or flower all spectrums is optimal + UVB and IR make a significant difference
2. Blues for veg / Reds for flower

Can someone geek out the facts for me?

 

[Beefbisquit]

During the spring and early summer plants get more light from the blue spectrum. As summer continues the light becomes more yellowish as it shifts more into the red spectrum. There will always be red wavelengths in spring, and vice versa; but plants have certainly evolved to use the most out of the suns energy in any given season.

LED manufactures have the ability to pick specific spectrum's, so providing an abundance of blue for vegging or red for flowering really allows us to capitalize on the way the plants have evolved.

It stands to reason that the closer we can get to replicating peak sunny conditions the better the crops we can grow. This includes appropriate UVB and IR.
I read somewhere that UVB rays make pot plants produce more resin to act as a sunblock.

If you only want a veg light, def go with the full blue, or a panel that is at least more blue than red....

EDIT: You can use an LED panel like the diamond that has the majority of red and some blue for both veg and flowering, but you can't use a blue LED panel to flower. So from that aspect, if you want a "jack-of-all-trades" LED panel, I'd suggest the Diamond series (or alternative).

 

[anotherdaymusic]

During the spring and early summer plants get more light from the blue spectrum. As summer continues the light becomes more yellowish as it shifts more into the red spectrum. There will always be red wavelengths in spring, and vice versa; but plants have certainly evolved to use the most out of the suns energy in any given season.

LED manufactures have the ability to pick specific spectrum's, so providing an abundance of blue for vegging or red for flowering really allows us to capitalize on the way the plants have evolved.

It stands to reason that the closer we can get to replicating peak sunny conditions the better the crops we can grow. This includes appropriate UVB and IR.
I read somewhere that UVB rays make pot plants produce more resin to act as a sunblock.

If you only want a veg light, def go with the full blue, or a panel that is at least more blue than red....

EDIT: You can use an LED panel like the diamond that has the majority of red and some blue for both veg and flowering, but you can't use a blue LED panel to flower. So from that aspect, if you want a "jack-of-all-trades" LED panel, I'd suggest the Diamond series (or alternative).

Exactly, Id say get a blue one unless sometime in the future you want to use it in your flower room.

 

[jubiare]

Guys, all blue for veg isn't really good. Only blue and that's it? naaaaaa
For example, I have a magnum and when I vegged I used only the blue for many days, I was advised to do that; well, plants had crazy internodes, but the plants were so short and compact that IT WAS WAY TOO MUCH. I should have done like 1 day in blue and three days at full spectrum, what I did was 3 days in blue and one day at full spectrum. I REALLY WOULDN'T BUY A ONLY BLUE PANEL, NO WAY.

 

[jubiare]

But from actual draw power, the penetrator and the advanced aren't much different. They are both great american made panels. And remember again, this is for a veg cab not a flowering cab.

You'd be surprised to know the truth here, american made? naaaaaaa

 

[jubiare]

apparently thinks the 2011 Spectra's are the best out currently so much hes actually said they are too powerful if you don't watch - he has to be mindful of burning and bleaching. I know your co-op just threw down alot of cash but I thought you might find it a good read.

you are quoting half of the story here, let's all of us try to say what we really know, not what we have barely touched. There is well documented journals that spectra v1 and v2 have had issues. Most growers have been unsuccessful and only 3 - 4 have succeded. Even Irishboy, the guy you mentioned, had the v1 and v2 swapped over with v3 during the last grow, what you see now growing, is under v3. Now, I am not saying that v1 and v2 are shit, but the reality is that.

 

[northlights]

I purchased a 90w UFO, 80 red and 10 blue, off Amazon.com and it works great. Light spectrum is good. Even with a primary red led ratio, plants still grew 12" in 3 weeks. Not too bad for $120 in my opinion.

 

[fossil22]

Fossil, thanks for your thoughts

Have you looked at Irishboy's journals by chance? He's used the penetrator in the past ( prob and older model which i agree does matter) and apparently thinks the 2011 Spectra's are the best out currently so much hes actually said they are too powerful if you don't watch - he has to be mindful of burning and bleaching. I know your co-op just threw down alot of cash but I thought you might find it a good read.

Thanks, I went and checked them out. Nice to see they added green to their spectrum and upgraded the drivers and heatsinks. Sure seems like they are on the right track. I just wish they would provide more specifications on their products. I noticed with some of the higher end lights now that they have raised the distance above the canopy recommendations. Im assuming its because LED Mfgs are coming out with more powerful and efficient diodes. (Gotta love the speed of technology) The one Im using said 12"-24", @12" I was getting signs of bleaching and burning as well, Im now at 24" and I still see some bleaching and burning, but not nearly as severe and Im scared if I raise it up any higher, Ill not only lose the intensity, but I wont be using the advanced spectrum to its full potential, but so far they seem to love it, Im in my 3 rd week of flowering now with this light and Im super impressed, so a few burned tips here and there are going to have to do for now. Could be strain related, who knows...

I still see a lot of light Mfgs packing in as many LEDs on a board as they can fit. Seems to me that would cause more heat, therefore causing a more rapid deterioration of the diodes. (Probably why some of the higher end Mfgs seem to be upgrading their heatsinks and heat dispersion methods) Id be curious to see test comparisons of lights as they age.

 

[anotherdaymusic]

You'd be surprised to know the truth here, american made? naaaaaaa

advanced led is a private family owned business... you should know the truth homie..right?

 

[Beefbisquit]

advanced led is a private family owned business... you should know the truth homie..right?

IF the claims of E.shine systems are accurate, than the manufacturing of at least the Diamond series lights takes place in China.

E.shine's LED's are all American made; as I would presume Advanced LED's are as well.... regardless of where the units are assembled, Advanced LED lights have a proven track record for growing dank ass bud!

 

[anotherdaymusic]

yeah when i purchased the light i even got a personal written letter from the family... i have nothing bad to say about them even if they are a small company.

 

[jubiare]

advanced led is a private family owned business... you should know the truth homie..right?

They are made in china aren't they guys. Yes it's an american company, all rite they don't even have their special branded case.. they are just the light from china selled by an american company.

Not a big deal, that's it. the point is, 99% of led company resell china stuff, some of them experiment and research for optimal spectrum and all of that, many others don't even bother Some use american made chips, many partially do, most dont use america made chips

What they all do, they charge us some extra money, some, way over the top.

It's the same as blackstar.. american company with factory in china (their own factory they claim?)

if you want to get harsh on me because of the way this business is, feel free

 

[Beefbisquit]

They are made in china aren't they guys. Yes it's an american company, all rite

It's the same as blackstar.. american company with factory in china (their own factory they claim?)

It at least LOOKS like it...

Advanced LED Lighting Diamond Series 200watt;

E.Shine Systems 200 watt;

 

[jubiare]

I still see a lot of light Mfgs packing in as many LEDs on a board as they can fit. Seems to me that would cause more heat, therefore causing a more rapid deterioration of the diodes. (Probably why some of the higher end Mfgs seem to be upgrading their heatsinks and heat dispersion methods) Id be curious to see test comparisons of lights as they age.

Look at evo leds for diodes better spaced around on the heat sink. Real good diodes as well, the best on the market cree-xpe higher bin. There is a grow on the net by Mr x called walking in the garden.
Or look at solstice led grow light by globaltech, using philips leuxon rebel.

Those are real american/spain companies, using quality diodes and assembling in their own country

 

[somedude247]

To avoid ALL the argueing and keep it simple, I have the 300w DS and find the plants veg better with BOTH switches on. All blue is a waste IMHO. And I dont care where its made as long as its done RIGHT!