HPS vs. LED Grow Lights — Which is Better for Growing Weed?

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snakedope

Well-Known Member
Even with my 2 X 800w panels, it took me some time to dial in the temp in the tent, they do get very hot (the ambient temp, not actual fixture) had to get an A\C and put it inside, also 2 large fans, and the summer here is brutal, so keeping it under 28c even with LEDs at this power is an electrical challange... not in terms of how to manage the heat, but to try and save money while doing it.
i always wondered why dont they come with fans above their heat sinks ? like CPUs... maybe they fear that heat will go to the plants, but maybe for some folks in cooler regions it can be a plus

To be honest, i had a GH Cheese strain i grew under HPS 400w, and i stuck that bulb to his ass lol and temp was high, very high 32-34c
But it came out to be killer smoke, very potent terpy old ams cheese funk, the tops were a little roasted so even when heat destroy your trichomes very fast, it can sometimes make it better (some strains), not all truth is 100% accurate, there is exceptions in everything in life i think.
 
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snakedope

Well-Known Member
Cannabisco said:
Makes sense why you don't like led.
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I grew with many more variations of LED my friend, never saw an exception, well i did, for worse, as other variations were not 800w "monsters"
But i guess it dosent matter too much, 1000 X 300 Lm diodes is still 300 Lm diodes, im still sticking to my initial story, now is not their time to shine, they will get there eventually.
And if a 800w 1000usd panel is making sense why i dont like them, i need to buy the 5000w model then, maybe then i will like them.
Not trying to inflict u with it, just my experience with them.
 
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snakedope

Well-Known Member
Lol i dont need anyone to believe me
They just go to the 315 Lec club or the 600 club, then they go to the LED grow journals and laugh their ass off of what LED growers call bud :D
See ? its easy to be mean :)
 
Cannabisco

Cannabisco

Active Member
snakedope said:
Lol i dont need anyone to believe me
They just go to the 315 Lec club or the 600 club, then they go to the LED grow journals and laugh their ass off of what LED growers call bud :D
See ? its easy to be mean :)
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Then why are you trying soooo damn hard coming off pathetic af.
I've already stated cmh & led are both superior to hps, the internet has said the same, scientists even have said it. Go watch some videos by Dr. Bruce Bugbee. Go take an unbiased walk throughout the interwebs & anyone can come to the same conclusion.
It's not 1989 anymore & as much as I would love it to be as simple as HPS is the be all end all; it simply is not. HPS is dead, it had one hell of a good run.. But LEC & LED are king and will be for decades to come. Sure HPS can grow bud, but it is inferior to LEC & LED. Most commercial grows & hobby grows are LED or LEC/LED checkerboard. HPS is not cost effective & having to mitigate heat, mitigate increased water uptake, having to constantly replace HPS bulbs frequently. Not Cost effective. Highest percent of meds are grown under LED wUV supplemented or LEC or a combo of both- research it. Not Tom dick & Harry grow journals.
Post pics of all your lights that you use to grow - first it was 150 watt hps, then 250 watt, then we all said the most efficient & effective was 600 watt , then 1k & 1k DE then all of a sudden you use 600 watt hps & then 1000 DE lol like wtf. And post all these G13 top medical grade mkUltra terpey donkey dicks crusted in trichome gorgeousness that you have so much experience growing.
Shaming LED when you are using a mediocre board with mediocre diodes from over 5 years ago- do you know how much LED has changed in 10yrs? 5yrs? 2 yrs? And it keeps getting better. Samsung Evo diodes boom right after LM301H&B. The tech is progressing faster than people can buy it. And most commercial grows are insured by manufacturers for futureproofing so as new tech hits the market they get upgraded for free. Why would they fuck around like it's still 1989 with HPS?

You wonder why people are having a hard time believing you, but have you read your posts?
I've grown indoor & outdoor for over 25 years and tried HPS, sorry but CMH & LED is simply better.
 
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Blue brother

Blue brother

Well-Known Member
snakedope said:
They are certainly not better, not for flowering MJ, not for now.
They will grow plants, as all lights will even the smallest Lm light, They will also grow trichomes, but have no "Kick" when it comes to producing them massively or in anyway compared to HID, both science and reality support this claim.
But again, im talking about today, the future looks bright for this tech in terms of power and spectrum, even more then CMH
I just personally hate LEDs because i know they are very toxic to DNA and our Eyes, thats why they are pushing them all over the world and in any segment of private life or business.
I wish that LED makers do realize in the near future that one cant go without the other, a perfect spectrum cant go without a matching intensity
A perfect trichome production cant go without both, not just one.
This situation portrays our actual nature, the sun, perfect spectrum with very high intensity which is what we all should strive for.
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Omg this has got to be where I draw the line trying to reason with you.

For starters, I am an optical Engineer, take that for what u want! But I am very sure of my above statement.
Secondly, it is universally agreed that modern led horticulture fixtures are BETTER than their HID counterpart, maybe not much depending on the situation. But certainly better in every aspect!

You want intensity? Coverage? CRI? Efficiency? Efficacy? Use led! Even if you replace 1000w de hps with 1000w input watts of high quality full spectrum high cri strips boards and cobs in an ai configured layout? Custom far and infra red diodes on their own timers? Independently trigger phytocromes? Extremely high quality uva uvb and uvc diodes? You still don’t think 1000w of led can be better than even 1000w de ceramic?

you’re either a fool or a troll with an agenda.

Almost every single trick hid has up its sleeve led can beat with better efficiency and efficacy and if not, it can do the same with. a fair deal more ease.

I grew with hps, dual arc, mh, cmh, plasma fluorescent etc for years, years and years and years and years.

I used to be a dick about it, I tried led Measured outpuT and the “reality” of it with real world applications, and told everyone in the blurple community my findings (got me a lot of hate). I used to be the guy…. “Lemme see a fixture with 8w diodes then I’ll take notice ha! Inverse square law this, laws of reflection that!”

truth is, they didn’t need this! Changing the layout of diodes changed the angle of incidence which changed the power value recieved by the buds and so on!

WE WERE FOOLS! And by the sounds of it YOU STILL ARE!
 
Rocket Soul

Rocket Soul

Well-Known Member
snakedope said:
You talk about the efficiency of a light source, yes, LED tech is more efficient at making light compared to HID, if you read the whole thread thats not what this is about, even though LED is more efficient as a standalone watt for watt then HID, it still comes in small wattage such as 2w 3w diodes that put out 300 Lm, so just like in any light source if you split it you wont get the total amount of light but get the total amount of each light source that you split, in our case HPS is a single light source that push 150K Lm, and a LED diode is a light source that push 300 Lm, it dosent matter if you put 300 of those next to each other, you still have 300 Lm max output but in 300 different places, you dont have now 300 X 300 lm output, because you spread the output to 300 bulbs.
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Why on earth do you believe this? By the same logic 2x 600hps over a 4x4 would give the same light as 1x 600hps. Since both the hps are the same intensity. What is about one light source that cancel out the other light sources? Why wouldnt the light from 2 light sources combine in intensity? Please explain and show some of that maths. Cite or link anything scientific where you got this idea from pleaee.

You have probably seen some pics of green houses using sunlight + hps lights for supplementation. How does this work? Would the total light on cannopy not be light from the sun + light from the hps? As the sun is more intense wouldnt it cancel out the hps light from your argument? Why would all this longtime professional growers use supplementary hps for years and years when your math proves that it doesnt work.

I promised myself on page 4 i would read all this thread before commenting but, well, i just cant swallow this inconsistent argument for 10 pages. I just hope it stopps somewhere around page 8.
 
Rocket Soul

Rocket Soul

Well-Known Member
snakedope said:
What does this testing tell us beside what we already know ? 650w total panel with many many low intensity diodes that put on avg par of 1780, cool, now lets try the same testing with a 600w hps at the same height, wanna guess the par numbers ?
You still dont accept the fact the the diode itself puts out 300 Lm, a plant can use most of this 300 Lm spectrum (as your par testing suggests) but its too weak to get to your plants at the first place !
its not personal, just ACTUAL light math.
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Oh god just show the math. And also ask someone about how crosslighting works.
 
Blue brother

Blue brother

Well-Known Member
Rocket Soul said:
Why on earth do you believe this? By the same logic 2x 600hps over a 4x4 would give the same light as 1x 600hps. Since both the hps are the same intensity. What is about one light source that cancel out the other light sources? Why wouldnt the light from 2 light sources combine in intensity? Please explain and show some of that maths. Cite or link anything scientific where you got this idea from pleaee.

You have probably seen some pics of green houses using sunlight + hps lights for supplementation. How does this work? Would the total light on cannopy not be light from the sun + light from the hps? As the sun is more intense wouldnt it cancel out the hps light from your argument? Why would all this longtime professional growers use supplementary hps for years and years when your math proves that it doesnt work.

I promised myself on page 4 i would read all this thread before commenting but, well, i just cant swallow this inconsistent argument for 10 pages. I just hope it stopps somewhere around page 8.
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Intensity can’t be added upon, the intensity of the light further down can never match that of the intensity at the source, all we can do is add more light at the same intensity to cover more of the 3D space by coming in at different angles and “navigating” vegetation obstacles (leaves etc).
 
Rocket Soul

Rocket Soul

Well-Known Member
snakedope said:
No it dosent, Lm defines intensity, PAR define how much of intensity is divided in the 400-700 spectrum
So Leds have lots of PAR, sure, cuz they are made to put light waves in the PAR spectrum, very very good indeed, but no power, only 2w, only 3w...
So no, intensity is not there.
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Lumens and luxx defines intensity as experienced by the human eye.
snakedope said:
So, ive grown with both of them, and also see in other people threads (the LED ones) that weight increased due to more diodes giving light at more places but the bud itself and quality for me was shit and to be honest also in most of the LED journals i look it looks shit too, when i say shit i mean when comparing to HPS or MH, each LED grow i smoke and see is shit quality, i mean what can you expect from a diode that only make 250 Lm ??

according to the book of old LED myths and legends chapter 2, an array of many leds (like the 600W+ panels) give you a total lets say 100,000 Lm right ? wrong ! you just added 300+ 250 Lm diodes together lol, its quite embarrassing that people forget simple math and logic when it comes to spending money on bogus claims, i saw on another thread here a LED panel that claims 5000 umol for 5000 $$ hahahaha i wonder if i put 10K i will get 10K umol :D people are so gullible these days and that goes for all led panels, ive pretty much tried them all from the lowest wattage ones to a "beast" 800w panels
And will never use them again, the only thing they do good is covering more space, but with what ? a low intensity small diode lol
i rather put 4 250W HPS on a 4 X 4 or even a 5 X 5 and get better results all day long, the only problem is heat, but i will take the 5-10% lose of light and power due to the glass in the airhood and some lower working temp for the bulb.
weight means nothing if most of it is leafy shit and not potent medicine, i dont care how long your trees are, its the med that counts, LED dont grow Meds like HPS, i dont know how people dont see it ?? look at LED flower and look at CMH or HPS flower, am i the only one who see the difference ?

They are all liars, in the bible it says that money will blind the just and the wise men, no exception in our times
First we started with 40-50 inch height recommendations, now the most expansive LEDs tell us to put them 5-6 inch from canopy ? so anyone with eyes in his head and some brain should know they are low intensity lights, next they will tell us to make the plants hug them for better penetration :D
Next they told us that they make 3000umol and 5000umol and it wont end there oh no the show must go on,
a 600 HPS will give you 2000 umol at 10 inch from canopy give or take, and under the hood itself not in the sides, that why HPS lacks the better light spreading of LED, but it makes up for it in creating and growing crazy potent ass MEDS

All in all i will never try LED again, such a waste of time
when they will show me a 250 or 400w diode that push more Lm then HPS maybe we meet again ;)
but then they are back to the start as HPS does that today without waiting haha
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Why use 4x 250hps for a grow in a 4x4 if the light from these bulbs dont combine? Or is there some special physics for hps and another to led diodes? Does crosslighting only work for hps or what? According to your argument you would get the same result from 1 x250hps as 4 since you light intensity dont add up. Please explain, or at least try to explain to yourself why you have these ideas. Or maybe back to underneath the bridge you came from.
 
Rocket Soul

Rocket Soul

Well-Known Member
Blue brother said:
Intensity can’t be added upon, the intensity of the light further down can never match that of the intensity at the source, all we can do is add more light at the same intensity to cover more of the 3D space by coming in at different angles and “navigating” vegetation obstacles (leaves etc).
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Thats a bit of a weird thing to say. And nonfactual. It most definitely add up. Why wouldnt 2 of the same lights be brighter than one? Please explain. Or maybe read up on physics.
 
Blue brother

Blue brother

Well-Known Member
Rocket Soul said:
Thats a bit of a weird thing to say. And nonfactual. It most definitely add up. Why wouldnt 2 of the same lights be brighter than one? Please explain. Or maybe read up on physics.
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Shine a torch at ur fence, so half of the light hits the fence and the other half shines above and beyond, then get another of the same torch and shine it at the same spot on you’re fence. Rather than see further into the distance, you will realise, you can only see as far as before, just better, you have more angles of incidence hitting a given object at a given distance. Sure more photons are hitting that surface, but only because there are more light sources, not because there is more intensity.
 
Rocket Soul

Rocket Soul

Well-Known Member
snakedope said:
Even with my 2 X 800w panels, it took me some time to dial in the temp in the tent, they do get very hot (the ambient temp, not actual fixture) had to get an A\C and put it inside, also 2 large fans, and the summer here is brutal, so keeping it under 28c even with LEDs at this power is an electrical challange... not in terms of how to manage the heat, but to try and save money while doing it.
i always wondered why dont they come with fans above their heat sinks ? like CPUs... maybe they fear that heat will go to the plants, but maybe for some folks in cooler regions it can be a plus

To be honest, i had a GH Cheese strain i grew under HPS 400w, and i stuck that bulb to his ass lol and temp was high, very high 32-34c
But it came out to be killer smoke, very potent terpy old ams cheese funk, the tops were a little roasted so even when heat destroy your trichomes very fast, it can sometimes make it better (some strains), not all truth is 100% accurate, there is exceptions in everything in life i think.
Click to expand...
Dude this is why your led grows suck, youre supposed to keep your led cannopy over 28C. Not by much but 27-30C is ideal, this due to the missing IR in all lights but leds. When you talk about "reality" results and not on paper results have you considered that maybe you just suck at growing with leds cause you try to do the same as hps? Youre the last hps warrior in a loooooooong line of growbros all claiming the same and when they eventually see their buddys led grow kick ass and see how they run the environment they all realized they were wrong. Do you know anyone who grows close to you? Youve spent 14 pages on this and only now you mention environment, showing everyone why you cant get hps results with leds.
 
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