Roger A. Shrubber
Well-Known Member
i agree, with good meanwell drivers, big heatsinks and fans you can't go wrong
Hps vs New L.E.D.s
- Thread starter J. Killroy13
- Start date
i agree, with good meanwell drivers, big heatsinks and fans you can't go wrong
Olive Drab Green
Well-Known Member
@Rahz
http://www.tastyled.com/
Although, he recently switched his T1-2100 option out for his new T1-V196 which uses a 1650mA driver but puts out like, 20 more PPF and 3 more PAR watts. Uses a Vero 26C 90CRI 3500k emitter.
I prefer Cree, but maybe I'm just being a fanboy.
Last edited:
tstick
Well-Known Member
One thing to keep in mind is what your ambient climate is at the time you do your grow(s). I prefer to grow during the colder months so that the various "bugs" in the air are at a minimum. And I currently grow using a Timber Grow Light...the CXB 400R (available on custom order only). It's a very powerful light, but it generates very little heat. So, I find myself supplementing that "lost" heat with a space heater. So, basically, it's another "robbing Peter to pay Paul" scenario. The efficiency of the light and the electrical savings and all that are then cancelled out by the added space heater! It's kind of the reverse situation that most HID growers face when they have to add AC to their grow spaces from all the heat the HID bulbs generate.
One thing to consider, then, might be how and when you grow. Ideally, you would try to find the naturally-perfect ambient temperature for the plants and then consistently maintain that temperature without having to amend it with heating or cooling apparatus.
I have been looking at those LEC 315 fixtures for just this reason. I might try one and see if the natural heat it creates would be sufficient to maintain ideal daytime temperatures during the colder months without having to run a heater. Of course, I would still have to run the heater in the room at night.
Also consider HOW you will grow...An HID light might solve your daytime heating issue, but, IF the tops of the plants get too close to the light, then the proximity to the heat can cook your best colas to a crisp! You might have to do a scrog to keep the plants low enough to allow plenty of space between the tops of the plants and the hot bulb. If you prefer to grow trees, then the cool LED with an added space heater in the room combo might be a better approach....and so on.
For the most efficient producer of photons, COB-based LED lights (Cree CXB 3590 COBs, specifically) are the best....at least according to all the arguments around here! LOL!
But you may want to consider some of these other things.I've also been coveting the Apache Tech AT600 for some time...hoping the price will go down so I can afford one! I like all kinds of lights, I guess! Lights are starting to become another addiction now! Beware! You might end up with "one of each" light out there.....like I'm heading towards!
Olive Drab Green
Well-Known Member
So this is one of my plants currently just barely three full weeks old and still in veg. You can clearly see the fan leaf is covered in capitate-sessile trichomes, some of which are appearing to amber already. This should prove to you, the quality of Tasty's COB builds (The two I use are his T1-2100s using Cree CXB3590s, 3500k, 80CRI, 36v, run at 2150mA each by two separate Meanwell LPF-90D-42 drivers; these Cree-based models were just recently replaced by his T1-V196 Vero 29C 3500k 90CRI-based models run at 1650mA)
Lordhooha
Well-Known Member
Not true I own two of kinds xl1000's it's a great light but cobs beat it. I'm running my xl1000's now while I rework my cob lights
Roger A. Shrubber
Well-Known Member
hmmm..of course the same thing is true for hid, just to a lesser extent since they are less efficient in producing usable light.......i think....
Olive Drab Green
Well-Known Member
HID is less efficient than LED. Much of its wattage is wasted, as the energy is converted to heat rather than photons, because HIDs are decades-old high powered incandescent technology, whereas LEDs are newer solid state technology, with much better efficiency, and most if not all of its energy is used to produce photons rather than heat. Heat sink and fan or not, I don't have to enclose the chip in a cool tube like I would an HPS, the bare chip can be left uncovered with an Angelina reflector for better light concentration. So you don't have to tack more energy expenditure onto your bill for cooling, nor do you have to worry about snow melting on your rooftop, blowing your cover. I can put my finger about half an inch from the surface of the emitter without burning myself. Also, it produces so much light, I can blind myself simply by reflecting the light off my palm. Finally, I can get the PPFD of about a 400-600w HPS in a smaller area using only 89w.
Does anyone know if HIDs typically produce trichomes on vegging plants? Because my COBs do.
Does anyone know if HIDs typically produce trichomes on vegging plants? Because my COBs do.
a mongo frog
Well-Known Member
Probably not, your lights are the best. All others are shit. Show us a bunch of dried buds from your awesome lights so we can see your greatness!!!!
Olive Drab Green
Well-Known Member
No dried buds yet, but here are the trichomes, which the plants have been producing since day 3 in seedling:
It's pretty amazing. 3 weeks old, still in veg, and you can clearly see capitate-sessile trichomes.
Dankistino
Well-Known Member
Why do you think that the early trichomes are indicative of effective lighting? I know Leprechaun says same.
Dot to dismiss frosty buds, of course we all love ice. But to keep it real we know icy buds are not necessarily potent buds.
Olive Drab Green
Well-Known Member
..How do you figure that? Trichomes = resin glands. Resin glands produce THC. So how, exactly, do more trichomes not translate to more potency?
And it's between the light and the strain. If the light is optimal, these early trichomes will be produced. The plant produces trichomes not only in defense of itself, but in response to optimally bright light, I believe I've heard as a sort of sunscreen.
Olive Drab Green
Well-Known Member
Do you know what hash and hash oil such as shatter are made of? They're made of trichomes. Are you saying hash or shatter aren't more potent than flower?
Dankistino
Well-Known Member
Ya thats a good question. Im not saying that tri's arent desirable. Just an observation from plants ive grown is that it's not unusual for an average looking bud to be a mind blower or a frosty bud to be so-so.
Sometimes two equally frosted buds have very different potencies. Does that mean that some of the trichomes were more filled? Or maybe the specific combo of all the psychoactive materials in the bud had a multiplier effect? I'm curious.
Olive Drab Green
Well-Known Member
To be fair, I'm sure it all depends on a plethora of factors, some of which are subjective. So, I can easily agree with what you're saying.
Dankistino
Well-Known Member
total agreement. I'm gonna scope out my sprouts more closely next time. I'm wondering how their baby leaf surfaces develop under my light. (cob)
Olive Drab Green
Well-Known Member
. What emitters and drivers, and at what voltage and amperage are you running your setup, out of curiosity? I use two Tasty T1-2100s. They consist of 1 CXB3590 36v 3500k 80CRI and 1 Meanwell LPF-90D-42 driven at 2150mA each. It may be less efficient to drive them at higher amperages, but at 89w each, I'm not too concerned about efficiency. These two builds cover my small closet pretty well. I'm just a simple closet med grower. With this setup, I'm only doing two medium-large mainlined plants at a time. I have a collective grow at another location, where I have my 2 ViparSpectra V450s alongside my partner's 5-6 year old BlackStar 500s for flowering 4 large mainlined plants at a time. In our veg/clone closet, we use 2x 240w BlackStar veg panels. We have only about 14 plants total.
Yodaweed
Well-Known Member
Because the amount of joules of energy is the same in all those applications, the only reason LEDs run cooler is because you use less wattage of them and they dissipate the heat so they aren't as hot to the touch, but they still raise temps in an enclosed grow room the same amount as any other light would of equal wattage. Efficiency has to do with useable light(PAR) not heat. 1000w of 40% efficiency is the same heat as 1000w of 1% efficiency just much less usable light but the heat out put would be the same in an enclosed area. This is the main reason we can calculate BTU of ANY light source using a simple equation.
http://rapidtables.com/convert/power/Watt_to_BTU.htm
And you can calculate the amount of energy by converting BTU to joules , 1 BTU = approx. 1,055 joules of energy / per hour.
Last edited:
Roger A. Shrubber
Well-Known Member
thats what was escaping me, thnx
Olive Drab Green
Well-Known Member
Joules of energy are wasted on unusable light and heat with HIDs.
I don't really understand how efficiency doesn't involve heat. Joule is a unit of energy. Heat is a form of converted energy. So is unusable light. So how, exactly, does efficiency have nothing to do with heat as well as light?
I don't really understand how efficiency doesn't involve heat. Joule is a unit of energy. Heat is a form of converted energy. So is unusable light. So how, exactly, does efficiency have nothing to do with heat as well as light?
Yodaweed
Well-Known Member
Light is just another form of heat, if you put your hand in the sun does it not heat up? It does heat up , and the reason why is because electrons are excited in light, (they vibrate) which causes heat, it's the same exact thing that causes fire to start. If you don't believe the facts I just said read this scientific publication.
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-exactly-does-light-tr/