Marijuana Bloom with 504W LED

I'm new to this site, so I'll start off by saying hello I'm currently doing a bloom test with LED's that I thought all of you might be interested in, but to start off, here's some background on me:

I've been a medical marijuana patient now for about 5 years. During that time, I've grown aeroponically, and because I didn't like anything on the market, I developed my own high-quality units. I consider myself a very professional grower, but everyone can make their own judgments. At my peak, I was running 4,000W dual spectrum over two 2' x 4' aero trays. Some things happened in my life, as they often do, so I downsized to 3000W over the same area. Below is a picture of a Strawberry Cough x White Rhino plant I grew back then. The plant was on the outside edge of the system (furthest away from the lights), and the cola you're staring out came out to be 31g-32g dried. The entire plant stood about 2.5' tall and yielded nearly 8oz's:




Anyhow, I help patients here in WA with setting up their gardens, getting the right equipment, clones, etc... and teaching them how to grow. For people seeking a medical authorization, I refer them to the appropriate clinics so they are able. One patient that I began working with about two years ago has progressed a lot, and like me, has switched to using LED's instead of HID. She's not the type to post pictures online, but she did say it was ok for me to take pictures of her progress. Prior to this bloom she was running 3800W of LED over the same 2 aeroponic trays that I use. Here are current progress pictures that I've been able to take of her grow:


These images were taken 8-22-09:








These images were taken 8-26-09:







These images were taken 9-1-09:








We added 1 more 126W today, so now we have 5 (630W total). These pictures were taken 9-4-09:

Here are some pictures of my own personal garden. I am currently running 6, 126W units (756W) LED over a 2' x 4' aero tray. On Tuesday, my other 6 units arrive for my other bloom tray, which means I'll finally be rid of my last 1000W, and 100% LED.

i want to see some pics of after harvest and cure! as i am willing to make the change if its all the same
do the leds grow just as thick and tight ?????

rino said:

i want to see some pics of after harvest and cure! as i am willing to make the change if its all the same
do the leds grow just as thick and tight ?????

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I'm seeing more compact buds using LED's, than I did with HID. There is less heat stress, which may have something to do with it, or it could be the amount of available light for photosynthesis? Either way, they buds are very dense, and it looks as though they'll weigh quite a bit once the plants are finished. My favorite part of the LED's, is that I no longer have any issues related to heat, and never will. No more lost or damaged crops because the A/C accidentally came unplugged, or the ventilation fan, etc...

subscribed +REP

but will you get the same yeild cuz i have heard that you get a lot less??

While I appreciate your input, LEDGirl, there is no way you can convince me that LED lighting can do this:















I just fail to see how LED lighting can even compare to HID lighting. Sure, you'll save a lot of money on your electric bill, but you'll never grow anywhere near the amount with comparable wattage.

subscribed im amazed at what u do with led lights, now if im understanding right u have ur own led company? or what?

I love how people start off their introduction into a thread by being a jerk and telling me what the lights I'm using "ABSOLUTELY CAN'T DO", instead of being respectful like others and saying "I'm interested to see how this turns out".

Congrats on the fact that you grew big buds. What strain is it? How many watts were you running?

PalmDale Kush said:

subscribed im amazed at what u do with led lights, now if im understanding right u have ur own led company? or what?

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Yes, I am a part-owner of a LED lighting company. The majority of the pictures I posted were done by a 3rd party though, not myself. I developed these lights specifically for growing marijuana. It took me 2 years of solid research and development before I had a product that was capable of competing against HID. I'm doing a grow test right now between a 126W panel and a 400W Hortilux Blue, on tomatoes. The LED is beating the MH by a long shot. Soon, we'll be adding in glass and ventilation on the 400W, and removing 1 of our plants from LED to put under it for bloom. Then we'll do a side-by-side bloom against a Professionally equipped 400W, and a standard LED.

We also have a professional marijuana grow test being carried out by a world-famous researcher and author that most everyone knows. He'll be using 3 of our 318W units (954W) against a 1000W HPS. He will do an excellent job of showing 1000W LED vs 1000W HID, and provide completely unbiased results.

LEDGirl said:

Yes, I am a part-owner of a LED lighting company. The majority of the pictures I posted were done by a 3rd party though, not myself. I developed these lights specifically for growing marijuana. It took me 2 years of solid research and development before I had a product that was capable of competing against HID. I'm doing a grow test right now between a 126W panel and a 400W Hortilux Blue, on tomatoes. The LED is beating the MH by a long shot. Soon, we'll be adding in glass and ventilation on the 400W, and removing 1 of our plants from LED to put under it for bloom. Then we'll do a side-by-side bloom against a Professionally equipped 400W, and a standard LED.

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thats pretty awsome is there a place i can check out these led lights?

PalmDale Kush said:

thats pretty awsome is there a place i can check out these led lights?

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I'm not sure if I'm really allowed to post links or anything like that, but if you do a google search for Hydro-Grow-LED, you'll find the lights.

LEDGirl said:

I love how people start off their introduction into a thread by being a jerk...

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Spoken like a true lady!

LEDGirl said:

...and telling me what the lights I'm using "ABSOLUTELY CAN'T DO", instead of being respectful like others and saying "I'm interested to see how this turns out".

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We've had many topics on LED lighting here in the past and it has pretty much been proven that they absolutely can't do what HID lighting can do. Type LED into the search function on this website and see for yourself.

LEDGirl said:

Congrats on the fact that you grew big buds. What strain is it? How many watts were you running?

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The first set of pics (the finished grow) were two different strains (mostly White Widow) grown with a combination of one 1000 watt HPS light and two 400 watt HPS lights. The second set of pics (my current grow in progress) are of five different strains (again, mostly White Widow) and are being grown under two 1000 watt HPS lights. The final yield looks to be anywhere in the neighborhood of 2.5-3 pounds dry in a 36 square foot area. Replicating those type of results with LED lighting would be damn near impossible.

LEDGirl said:

Yes, I am a part-owner of a LED lighting company. The majority of the pictures I posted were done by a 3rd party though, not myself.

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Well, there you have it, folks.

Dillweed and LEDgirl very impressive.

Dillweed while I am pro HPS for efficiency as of now, LED lighting WILL be able to out do that in the future. PAR ratings can far outweigh those of HPS because it is completely customizeable to the exact wavelength of spectrum wished.

Now as far as lumenous output currently HPS lumen per watt is significantly higher than all competitors on the market, however as the efficiency of LED lighting increases scientists are stating that somewhere over 200 lpw will be possible in the future. Also, some labratory tests have already demonstrated 150 lumens per watt. How long will it be before they are on the market- I don't know but it will be possible to outperform HPS watt for watt with LEDS just not today.

Other things that should be considered is initial capital outlay. LEDS have longer life than HPS but cost per watt is high comparatively. So Break-even analysis should be considered when purchasing and determine if the initial cash outlay is worth it to you. It may be cost prohibitive for some to start.

That said I have 3x 600w HPS and while I am a huge supporter of alternative energy and lowering carbon footprint; I just can't do it to my babies. When LEDS are ready you can bet I'm going to make the change, I just wonder when that will be.



-potlike

DillWeed said:

We've had many topics on LED lighting here in the past and it has pretty much been proven that they absolutely can't do what HID lighting can do. Type LED into the search function on this website and see for yourself.

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First off, there are TONS of different LED lights on the market, so which ones are you speaking of when you say that "they absolutely can't do what HID lighting can do"? The one Red, one Blue lights? The Red/Blue/White lights? The Red/Blue/Orange lights? The 5 band lights with orange? Lights from Theoreme Innovation? Procyon? Lumigrow? Who??? Each MFR uses similar specs, but they're all different. Different nm, different percentages, but most all the same intensity (120 degree lenses).

Unlike those people, these LED lights use 440nm, 470nm, 640nm, 660nm, 3000k white, and 740nm. Marijuana has peak absorption points for photosynthesis at 439nm, 469nm, 642nm, and 667nm, with peak points for carotenoids at 439nm and 483nm. If a light misses any of these points, growth will be decreased. If the light isn't matched to these points (like they used a 450nm blue instead), you won't have the same growth either. Likewise, if a company is using a 120 degree LED, vs a 60 degree LED, the one with 60 degree is going to produce better results, in a far more reasonably rated coverage area.

DillWeed said:

The first set of pics (the finished grow) were two different strains (mostly White Widow) grown with a combination of one 1000 watt HPS light and two 400 watt HPS lights. The second set of pics (my current grow in progress) are of five different strains (again, mostly White Widow) and are being grown under two 1000 watt HPS lights. The final yield looks to be anywhere in the neighborhood of 2.5-3 pounds dry in a 36 square foot area. Replicating those type of results with LED lighting would be damn near impossible.

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It's cool, the researcher who will be using 954W of our LED vs a 1000W HPS, will do a good job at showing you that 1000W of LED is more than capable of growing 1.5 - 2 pounds like your 1000W. In fact, we expect his yields to be higher than 4lbs with LED, but only time will tell. Stick around and watch instead of continuing to deny that there is any LED product on the market that con compare to a HID, because you sir, have not used them all. From the sounds of it, you haven't used any personally...

potlike said:

Dillweed and LEDgirl very impressive.

Dillweed while I am pro HPS for efficiency as of now, LED lighting WILL be able to out do that in the future. PAR ratings can far outweigh those of HPS because it is completely customizeable to the exact wavelength of spectrum wished.

Now as far as lumenous output currently HPS lumen per watt is significantly higher than all competitors on the market, however as the efficiency of LED lighting increases scientists are stating that somewhere over 200 lpw will be possible in the future. Also, some labratory tests have already demonstrated 150 lumens per watt. How long will it be before they are on the market- I don't know but it will be possible to outperform HPS watt for watt with LEDS just not today.

Other things that should be considered is initial capital outlay. LEDS have longer life than HPS but cost per watt is high comparatively. So Break-even analysis should be considered when purchasing and determine if the initial cash outlay is worth it to you. It may be cost prohibitive to some to start.

That said I have 3x 600w HPS and while I am a huge supporter of alternative energy and lowering carbon footprint; I just can't do it to my babies. When LEDS are ready you can bet I'm going to make the change, I just wonder when that will be.



-potlike

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Excellent post. You made your point intelligently and managed to not be as over-eloquent as others. I can tell you have done far more research than I have on the subject at hand. The only point I was trying to make (which you confirmed) was that right now LED lighting cannot compare to HID lighting in regards to growing marijuana.

Anyway, +Rep from me to you coming right up.

I want to subscribe to this thread.... I have been using LEDs for a year or so now...mainly for veging but I know that it wont be long before the technology will out perform HID
I'm looking forward to the day I can run my grow on solar power....
LEDgirl you go..!!!.... thanks for starting this thread :^D

potlike said:

Now as far as lumenous output currently HPS lumen per watt is significantly higher than all competitors on the market, however as the efficiency of LED lighting increases scientists are stating that somewhere over 200 lpw will be possible in the future. Also, some labratory tests have already demonstrated 150 lumens per watt. How long will it be before they are on the market- I don't know but it will be possible to outperform HPS watt for watt with LEDS just not today.

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There are white 1W LED's that are currently capable of producing 170 lumens per watt. That's more than HID... Cree sells them, Luxeon sells some close, and so do other major LED MFR's.

potlike said:

Other things that should be considered is initial capital outlay. LEDS have longer life than HPS but cost per watt is high comparatively. So Break-even analysis should be considered when purchasing and determine if the initial cash outlay is worth it to you. It may be cost prohibitive for some to start.

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The 126W retails at $399.95, and compares to a 400W HID in a 2' x 3' grow area. If you're looking at system cost, instead of watt per watt cost, it's similar to a nice 400W setup (air-cooled hood, quality ballast, quality bulb). LED's retain 70% of their original light output after 50,000 hours (6 solid years). There are no bulbs to replace or ballasts to replace, like HID. The power consumption is about 70-80% less than HID, while producing comparable results (though not true of all LED grow lights). There are lots of places you save with LED, but you're right that they have a higher initial cost. With the added benefit that you'll never have heat stress issues related to lighting, you can count on getting more consistent yields, and no lost crops, which is a big deal for most growers in their first 1-3 years (depending on how fast they progress).

LEDGirl said:

Stick around and watch instead of continuing to deny that there is any LED product on the market that con compare to a HID, because you sir, have not used them all. From the sounds of it, you haven't used any personally...

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I will stick around and watch, but it would be hard for me to trust the results of a comparison study involving LED lighting versus any other source done on behalf of someone who co-owns a LED lighting company. It just screams bias.

And no, I personally have never used LED lighting myself for a variety of reasons. The main one being that in the dozens of threads about LED lighting I have perused on this website I have never, I repeat, NEVER seen results as good as my own. And at the end of the day, there are far more experienced growers on this forum than myself so if a semi-n00b like me can outperform every single LED lighting grow I have ever seen, then why should I abandon HID lighting?