Roseman's DIY Bubbleponics Tutorial - Page 2

Roseman · #11 08-29-2009, 02:09 PM

These meters have been loaned to three other growers besides me, and they have really benn used and abused.
I bought a bottle of LCR, LIME, RUST and CALCIUM remover,
poured a small amount in a quart jar, and as you see in these pics, I soaked the tips of the meters in the LCR in the jar, for 20 minutes.

After soaking the meters in the LCR, I rinsed them a long time in flowing water, and very gently scrubbed them in water, with a soft bristled toothbrush.

After I rinsed the meters and brushed the tips with a tooth brush, I rinsed my jar very good, and poured some household vinegar in the jar.
Then I soaked the tips in the vinegar for 20 minutes. Later I rinsed them in water again, dipped them back in the vinegar, and dried them with a paper towel, and left them to air dry for an hour.

Time now to calibrate the pH meters.

Roseman · #12 08-29-2009, 02:10 PM

One of the most aggrevating things I've ever attempted was calibrating a pH meter.
Makes me want to just pee straight up!
And what makes it worst, is having two pH meters to compare results.

Let me give you a heads up about calibrating a pH meter and using it. You have to just use it as a "rule of thumb" so to speak, and use it to try to stay within range.
For those that already know and those that do not, you can put an expensive $54 super-duper pH meter in water, test it, read it, get 6.8 and take it out, stick it back in, and it will be a little different, like 6.6. Shake it around in the water, stir it in the water and you'll get a different results, like 6.4, in the exact same water. Then take it out of the water, turn it off, and put it back in the same water, turn it back on in the water, and read 6.5, blow on it and get 6.9.
Temperature of water makes a big difference in the pH of water.
Shaking and stirring the meter in the water, makes a slight difference.
Turning it on IN the water and turning it on OUT of the water, makes a slight difference.
Turning it OFF and ON in the same water, makes a difference.
Waiting three minutes yields a different reading too.

I had year old calibration solution, but it was still clear looking and smelled OK. I used it and adjusted my meter, and then I used it and adjusted my meter, and then I used it and adjusted my meter, and then I used it and adjusted my meter, and then .......well,,,that took an hour.
I would put it in the 4.0 solution, get it to read 4.0 by adjusting it, (there is a SET SCREW you turn to make it go up or down) then put it in the 6.8 solution, it would read 7.1, I 'd turn it down to make it say 6.8, then try it again in the 4.0 and it would read 3.7!

After I spent an hour, spliting the difference, going back adn forth, it was very close to accurate to the calibration solution. In 6.8, it read 6.7, and in the 4.0, it read 4.1. Sounds good enough, huh?
Then, I checked it with my old meter, and good grief! The old meter said the 4.0 was 3.5 and the 6.8 was read as 6.2.
Took another hour to get the two meters to agree within .5 difference, which is really a broad difference, but one I will accept.
AND I am not even going to compate them to the tEST STRIPs tonight, although I will later.

If you ever want to really drive someone crazy, or start them drinking early, buy them TWO pH meters, and ask them to adjust and calibrate them to perform the same.

Anyway, I got two pH meters, fairly close to reading the smae, but not really. What's a pot head to do?

The pics show my efforts.

Roseman · #13 08-29-2009, 02:10 PM

pH

I am starting to soak my air stones and cubes in pH water of 6.0, and I want to discuss pH here.

pH, oh so important.

pH is measured on a scale from 1.0 to 14.0. Pure water has a pH of 7.0 and is considered pH neutral. pH below 7.0 is considered to be acidic and pH higher than 7.0 is considered to be alkaline.
A substance that decreases pH (pH-down) is called an acid while a substance that increases pH (pH-up) is called a base. A substance that helps nutrient solutions resist pH changes when an acid or base is added, is called a buffer. ..or stabilizer.
A pH difference of 1.0 is equal to a ten times increase or decrease in pH. That is, a nutrient solution with a pH of 6.0 is ten times as acidic as a nutrient solution with a pH of 7.0. A pH difference of 2.0 is equal to a hundred times increase or decrease in pH.
It is very important to keep the pH level in your water within certain limits when growing marijuana. Most grow-books say strive for 5.9, or some books say 5.6 to 6.2. Some books say 5.5 to 6.5, and you will not find two books that say the exact same thing. Growers need to monitor the pH of their nutrient solution and keep it within recommended levels.
The pH level of your hydroponic nutrient solution will determine how well your plants are able to eat and absorb nutrients. If the pH level is out of the proper range, the growth rate of the plants will slow down or stop.

Almost a 1/4 of all the problems I read about that growers experience are due to pH problems.
There are pH meters and test strips to test the pH of your water.
There are additives, or chemicals, made to adjust it, called pH UP and pH Down. These additives are to be used in very small amounts, like one gram, or 1/4 level teaspoon per gallon of water. (just a pinch)

First you have to realize that the pH is going to change daily as the nutrients are eaten. That means adjusting it daily. Goal is that those daily changes be slight and not major or drastic. And too remember, different sources of water yield different pH problems.

You have to have pH balanced nutes, and normal regular water or a buffer or a stabilizer in the water to keep it from roller coasting and spiking up and down.

I've done some research on pH Control and I 'd like to offer some advice and my opinion.

NEW growers worry about it too too much, and the biggest mistake they make is trying for a perfect contstant same pH.
You will do better, to just try to keep it between 5.6 and 6.8 without changing it often. Plants eat more nitrogen at 5.7 to 5.9 than at 6.7 to 6.8. But they eat more iron and magnesium at 6.5 to 6.8. You need a fluctuating pH level for your plants to absorb different nutes at different levels.
When you prepare your water, add nutes and pH test it, no matter what the results, if it is between 5.6 and 6.4, leave it alone or only adjust it slightly by .1 to .2 down.
Do NOT try to make it exactly 5.9.
DO NOT PLAY the pH Game.
Do NOT ride the pH Roller Coaster.
Do NOT adjust it more than .5 in 4 hours.

It is better to be off, too high, or too low, than to adjust it too much at one time.

Drastic or FAST adjustments really mess up the entire system.
Adjust gradually, and slowly.

The pH should not vary more than .5 to .7 everyday, and if it does flucuate alot more up OR down daily, something is wrong.
First, ask yourself, IF growing in HYDRO, what is going into the tank? Water, Nutes, pH UP and Down should be it. Adding anything else, WHEN YOU DO NOT HAVE A PROBLEM, is not the wisest thing to do. (Yes, sometimes some small amount of peroxide or hydrozyme might be needed, but I've done 7 grows without it.)
And if you are making NUTE SOUP, ( a nute mix and supplement mix of more than two nutrients) I can not help you or advise you about your pH.

Except for the very first time you add the water to the tank, You should pH balance your water FIRST, everytime, outside of the tank, then add the nutes, pH balance it again, then add it to the tank. Rule of thumb is your pH should not go up more than .5 within one 12 hour day or 1.0 in 24 hours.
If it does go up more in one day or two days, you got to do something to stabilize it. After the first two or 3 weeks pass, and the plants are drinking a gallon a day, you can add one gallon back that is over adjusted or over compensated, to get it back down. FOR EXAMPLE, If the tank is reading 7.2, then add one gallon of 6.2, and you'll get it down SOME, without it being too drastic.
DRASTIC pH CHANGES WITHIN 24 HOURS ARE VERY DANGEROUS.

IF YOU ARE HAVING A PROBLEM, AND ONLY IF IT IS GOING UP AND DOWN WILDLY, then try adding a lump of charcoal or two, tied in a panty hose or nylon stocking to the tank.
OR
Go to Walmart or PetSmart to the Aquarium Dept, next to the fish food, filters and additives and sea salts, and get those little packages of Ammonia Control absorbent packets. They look like little sponges in a wrapper. They work great to stabilize the pH. Or get the Ammonia control packets and add a couple to the tank.
IF YOU ARE HAVING A PROBLEM, AND ONLY IF IT IS GOING UP AND DOWN WILDLY, and you need a remedy then get everything in your tank like you want it, (except the roots or plants,) and add two heaping tablespoons of baking soda to a gallon of water,Stir it good, then add it to the tank. Wait ten or 15 minutes, then pH adjust it again. Then it should stay stabilized until the next Drain and Replenish.

From the book:
A buffer solution is an aqueous solution consisting of a mixture of a weak acid and its conjugate base or a weak base and its conjugate acid. It has the property that the pH of the solution changes very little when a small amount of acid or base is added to it. Buffer solutions are used as a means of keeping pH at a nearly constant value in a wide variety of chemical applications.

IF YOU ARE HAVING A PROBLEM, AND ONLY IF IT IS GOING UP AND DOWN WILDLY,
you can simply add two heaping table spoons of baking soda to your water, (before you put it in the tank). Yes, it will wreck the pH, but then you adjust it with pH Down, OUT OF YOUR TANK, and then it will stay more stable for a few days longer.

Primarily what one needs to add to the water are neutralizers and buffers that will stabilize the acid and alkaline levels to the degree that is required for the plants. Most of these stabilizing products are sold in great volume at any pet store that specialized in aquariums and tropical fish and if one is not familiar with what product to purchase, then one should consult with the qualified salespeople so as to arrive at a specific product that will properly address the specific needs of the fish and their owner. You want something that reduces the acid.

Roseman · #14 08-29-2009, 02:12 PM

Let me discuss pH more here.

pH is measured on a scale from 1.0 to 14.0. Pure water has a pH of 7.0 and is considered pH neutral. pH below 7.0 is considered to be acidic and pH higher than 7.0 is considered to be alkaline.
A substance, an additive that decreases pH (pH-Down) is called an acid while a substance that increases pH (pH-Up) is called a base. A substance that helps nutrient solutions resist pH changes when an acid or base is added, is called a buffer or stabilizer.
A pH difference of 1.0 is equal to a ten times increase or decrease in pH. That is, a nutrient solution with a pH of 6.0 is ten times as acidic as a nutrient solution with a pH of 7.0. A pH difference of 2.0 is equal to a hundred times increase or decrease in pH.
It is very important to keep the pH level within certain limits when growing marijuana. Even first time marijuana growers need to monitor the pH of their water-nutrient solution and keep it within optimum levels.
The pH level of your hydroponic nutrient solution will determine how well your plants are able to absorb nutrients. If the pH level is out of the proper range, the growth rate of the plants will slow down or stop.

We use TEST STRIPS or pH METERS to test and read the pH of the water.

First you have to realize that the pH is going to change daily as the nutrients are eaten. That means adjusting it daily. Goal is that those daily changes be slight and not major or drastic. And too, different sources of water yield different pH problems. The most difficult water is water HIGH in Minerals, or water that has NO minerals, like Filtered or Distilled water.

You have to have pH balanced nutes, or a buffer or a stabilizer in the water to keep it from roller coasting and spiking up and down.

I've done some research on pH Control and I 'd like to offer some advice and my opinion.

NEW growers worry about it too too much, and the biggest mistake they make is trying for a perfect contstant same pH.

Some grower books say strive for 5.9. Some books say between 5.6 and 6.8. Some experts recommend 5.7 to 6.3.
None agree or say the same thing although they all say keep it in the middle of acidity and alkaline.

You will do better, to just try to keep it between 5.6 and 6.8 without changing it often or more often than daily. Plants eat more nitrogen at 5.7 to 5.9 than at 6.7 to 6.9. But they eat more iron and magnesium at 6.5 to 6.8. You need a fluctuating pH level for your plants to absorb different nutes at different levels.
When you prepare your water, add nutes and pH test it, no matter what the results, if it is between 5.6 and 6.4, leave it alone or only adjust it slightly by .1 to .2 down.
DO NOT PLAY the pH Game.
Do NOT ride the pH Roller Coaster.
Limit adjsutments to once a day.
Avoid going UP and Down the same day.

It is better to be off, too high, or too low, than to adjust it too much at one time in one day.

Drastic or FAST adjustments really mess up the entire system.
Adjust gradually, and slowly.

The pH will vary daily, but should not vary more than .5 to .7 everyday, and if it does flucuate alot more up OR down daily, something is wrong.
First, ask yourself, IF growing in HYDRO, what is going into the tank? Water, Nutes, pH UP and Down should be it. Adding anything else, WHEN YOU DO NOT HAVE A PROBLEM, is not the wisest thing to do. (Yes, sometimes some small amount of peroxide or hydrozyme might be needed, but I've done 7 grows without it.)
And if you are making NUTE SOUP, ( a nutrient mix and supplement mix of more than two nutrients, supplements or catalysts) I can not advise you or help you with your pH.

Except for the very first time you add the water to the tank, You should pH balance your water FIRST, everytime, outside of the tank, then add the nutes, pH balance it again, then add it to the tank. It should not go up more than .5 within 12 hours or 1.0 in 24 hours.
If it does go up more in one day, you got to do something to stabilize it. After the first two or 3 weeks pass, and the plants are drinking a gallon a day, you can add one gallon back that is over adjusted or over compensated, to get it back down. FOR EXAMPLE, If the tank is reading 7.2, then add one gallon of 6.0, and you'll get it down SOME, without it being too drastic.
DRASTIC pH CHANGES WITHIN 24 HOURS ARE VERY DANGEROUS.

IF YOU ARE HAVING WILD EXTREME FLUCUATIONS,
try adding a lump of charcoal or two, tied in a panty hose or nylon stocking to the tank.
IF YOU ARE HAVING WILD EXTREME FLUCUATIONS,
go to Walmart or PetSmart to the Aquarium Dept, next to the fish food, filters and additives and sea salts, and get those little packages of Ammonia Control absorbent packets. They look like little sponges in a wrapper. They work great to stabilize the pH. Or get the Ammonia control pellets and add a few to the tank, IF YOU ARE HAVING WILD EXTREME FLUCUATIONS.

IF YOU ARE HAVING WILD EXTREME FLUCUATIONS, get everything in your tank like you want it, (except the roots or plants,) and add two heaping tablespoons of baking soda to a gallon of water,Stir it good, then add it to the tank. Wait ten or 15 minutes, then pH adjust it again. Then it should stay stabilized until the next Drain and Replenish.

A buffer solution is an aqueous solution consisting of a mixture of a weak acid and its conjugate base or a weak base and its conjugate acid. It has the property that the pH of the solution changes very little when a small amount of acid or base is added to it. Buffer solutions are used as a means of keeping pH at a nearly constant value in a wide variety of chemical applications.

IF YOU ARE HAVING WILD EXTREME FLUCUATIONS,
primarily what one needs to add to the water are neutralizers and buffers that will stabilize the acid and alkaline levels to the degree that is required for the plants. Most of these stabilizing products are sold in great volume at any pet store that specialized in aquariums and tropical fish and if one is not familiar with what product to purchase, then one should consult with the qualified salespeople so as to arrive at a specific product that will properly address the specific needs of the fish and their owner. You want something that reduces the acid.

Do not use the charcoal, or buffers if you do not have to have them. They are only to be used in extreme flucuations.

Roseman · #15 08-29-2009, 02:13 PM

I am almost ready to really start, but I still have a lot of prepreation yet to accomplish.
I will be using 2 14-inch long blue aquarium airstones in each 8 gallon size tank, with 6 gallons of water in each tank. I will be using 2 8-inch long blue aquarium airstones in the 5 gallon bucket.
Air tubes and Air Diffussers and Air Wands are much better. I use the cheaper stones and just thow them away after each grow.

I have seen a grow done with a one inch round stone, and it worked fine.

In my first two grows, I used a 4 inch round stone, like you see here next to the long ones:

Then I started reading the importance of Air or Oxygen in my water for rapid growing.
The more oxygen in the water, the faster the rate of growth.
I need to SOAK my airstones, and prepare them in a pH water of 5.9. I wanted to soak them for an hour or two, in pH balanced water.
I use a powder pH Down solution that says use .2 gram, (2/10s gram) to adjust one gallon of water by .1 measurement of pH.
Let me say here a gram is a just a pinch.
2.4 grams ( a measurement of weight) equals one measured level teaspoon.
I want 4 gallons of water, close to 5.9 or 6.0, to soak my stones in.
I use well water and it comes out of the faucet cold at 6.9, 7.0 and 7.1 pH. It varies according to the temperature of the water.
I wanted my 7.0 water to be 5.9, so I wanted to adjust it 1.0 down in pH to get it to 6.0.
To adjust it ten times .1, I needed ten times .2 grams of pH Down adjustment powder. So I used 10 time .2 grams, equals 2 grams. 2 grams is slightly less than a teaspoon, so I added a teaspoon of adjustment powder to each gallon of my water, and after I had 4 gallons in the bucket, and adjusted it, it read 5.8, close enough to my goal!
In the pics, you see me adjusting my water and soaking my air stones in the 5.8 water.

I am getting excited and anxious, but I want to be cautious and prepare every detail as wisely as I can.

Roseman · #16 08-29-2009, 02:13 PM

Let me discuss Hydroponics, indoor growing, compared to outdoor, soil growing.
There is a fast train, and there is Bubleponics!

Naturally, normally, I would plant seeds in my area, in Springtime, outdoors, in April. They would get sunlight about ten hours a day, with the sunlight increasing as Summer nears.
As Summer approaches, they would get 12 hours of light a day, and up to 14 hours of light, everyday, in mid to late summer.
During that time, the plants are in the VEGATIVE (VEG) or GROWING cycle.
Then, in July, when the days start getting shorter, they would realize their days are fewer and numbered and they will start the FLOWERING or BLOOM cycle.

This will take April, May, June, July, August, September and part of October to complete the cycles, at least 6 full months.

I will cut that grow time in half, by providing 24 hours of light 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, what we call 24/7 of light. After I provide light 24/7 for 5 weeks, I will change to 12 hours of light and 12 hours of darkness, for 8 weeks, about 13 weeks total for my Indica grow.

Roseman · #17 08-29-2009, 02:26 PM

Reflectivity, Reflection of Light

I will be using CFLs, Compact Flourscent Lights, for Light in this grow. I will get deeper into discussing LIGHT and CFLs later, but here I want to discuss Reflectivity, Reflection of Light.
I am just about done preparing my closet, but I need to prepare the walls to reflect my Light that escapes and is not directed on to the plants. I will be using Reflector Clamps on each bulb, but much light still escapes the Reflectors.
CFL bulbs emit the most lumens from the sides of the bulb and not from the end or tip of the bulb. (Lumen is the measurment of perceived light, or seen light) Much of this light escapes flowing on the plants and can be captured and redirected with proper reflective material on the walls. That is a good reason to grow in a small closet. The walls are very close to my plants and can not only contain the plants and help hold them up, the walls also can reflect the light too, with proper reflective material on the walls. The walls or closet also help contain the Odor, the Humidity and Temperature too. If I was forced to grow out in the middle of a large room, it would be better to obtain a "Grow Tent" to contain my Lights and Plants.

The light generated by HID Lights, (High Intensity Discharge) or CFLs is great for plants, but it can be a source of frustration for gardeners whose living areas are cramped or don’t have an extra small room or small closet for an indoor garden.

With a Grow Tent, aka Dark Room, or Dark Tent however, those frustrations are a thing of the past. A Grow Tent is the foundation of a completely self-contained indoor garden, featuring a lightweight, durable, washable interior reflective lining that keeps more light going where it’s supposed to go; to the plants.

The frame supports the lighting, ventilation or other equipment, and every unit has access ports that accommodate ducting or other equipment. DarkRooms or Grow Tents can be assembled without tools in minutes by one person, and collapse just as quickly for storage.

Grow Tents come in many differnet sizes, and run $80 up to $360, depending on size.
And of course if you are a handy dandy DIY (Do It Yourself) kind of person, you could build one with PCV pipe or 2 X 2 strips of wood as a frame and use any of a dozen different materials for the sides.

I prefer my closet, the cost was surely right.

If you want to start an arguement in an Internet Grow-Forum Website, just bring up Reflectivity as a topic of discussion. You will read all kinds of rants about Mirrors not reflecting light, Tin Foil causes Hot Spots, Flat White Paint vs Glossy White paint, Plastic film similar to garbage bags called Panda Film, Diamond Foil and Insulation Foil boards, and all sorts of arguements about which perform best and which are useless or harmful.

I could quote what I have read from books, but I would rather tell you what I have personally experienced. I hate to say "they say" as a source of infomation. When someone offers me advise and starts with "They say that....." well, I ignore them.

I expermiented with Tin Foil and CFLs on two grows and never saw any evidence of a Hot Spot or burnt place on my plants. I have read on Internet Grow Forums about many growers using Tin Foil and HID lights and getting hot spots or burnt spots on their plants.

I have used Flat White and Glossy White paint on the walls and both worked well for me. If you google "flat white, glossy white, reflection" you will find that more growers agree that Flat White is better reflecting 75%, and Glossy White reflecting 65%. But that is "they say" advise. "They say" tin foil will make burn spots on your plants, but I never saw one when I tried it. And I had 14 bulbs in the closet and tin foil on all the walls.
Panda Film, a plastic film just like garbage bags are made from, works well too. It is rated in the 80% to 905 range. The newest material being used now for reflection is called Diamond Reflective Foil. "They say" the diamonds prevent hot spots. I do not know for sure.

Let me emphasis here again, I do not listen to, or go by "they say" advise. I advise you to investigate and verify any "they say " advise.

From my own personal experience, from 9 of the 14 books I own on Indoor Growing, from many years of reading on Internet Grow Forums, MYLAR is the highest recommended reflective material to use on the walls and on this grow, I have added MYLAR to my closet walls. MYLAR is a plastic film, also called polywrap, like you see Birthday and Holiday Baloons made from.
It is reported to supply a 98% reflection of light.

I used 5 rolls of two sided sticky cellophane tape to attach my mylar to the walls. I used 2 millimeter thickness, because I will be spraying and misting my plants often and the thicker MYLAR is easier to wipe down and not tear.

I paid $30 for a 50 inch by 25 foot roll and used half a roll.

And an added suggestion from my grow buddy, SmokeDoggy:

Another good tip while we're talking about reflective walls, is to try some of the "drawer liner" stuff. It usually is already sticky on one side, a lot less inconspicuous than mylar, does not create hotspots (no crinkling) just in case, and it is flat white. I use it in my micro box (20x36x25) and it works awesome. The whole box now "glows" on all 4 walls, ceiling, and floor. It also doesn't bunch up or fall down, etc.. Not dissing mylar, but this is a lot easier to come by and work with, and it seems to do just fine for me.

Roseman · #18 08-29-2009, 02:28 PM

Time to get my old used 7 times tanks ready and wash them.
These two lids have seen a total of 7 grows, and the white you see is mineral salts, or mineral deposits from my well water. These mineral deposits are often feared to be MOLD, and are often seen on the lids, the rims of the grow cups, on the rockwool cubes and on the Hydroton rocks. MOLD will stink, be slimey, be thick, and have black streaks or black spots in it.
Minearal Deposits will NOT smell or stink, will be very thin and will be gritty. The mineral deposits are not to be feared or worried about and will cause no harm, if you clean them up after each grow.

To clean the lids, I will be using a CLR remover, Calcium, Lime and Rust remover, meant to be used in bathrooms. I will use a stiff brush, and a metal mesh pan scrubber. To rinse the CLR off of the lids and be sure I did not leave any, I will use common vinegar to rinse everything.
Vinegar is very safe and works well for cleaning up after and before a hydroponic grow.

Roseman · #19 08-29-2009, 02:28 PM

That was a lot of scrubbing and work, but they look good as new now. The vinegar really works well as a rinsing acid.

All that hard scrubbing and I had to have some liquid refreshment and a smoke to adjust my attitude.

Roseman · #20 08-29-2009, 02:29 PM

Cleaning the Water Pumps

Look at these pics of this pump and see the old dead decayed roots hung up in the filter, inside the pump.

There is all kinds of dead root trash in that pump.

For three years, and 5 grows, I used a smaller water pump, a 185 gph pump. (gallon per hour) Now I have started using these 240 gph pumps, because they last longer and have a built in filter in them. Now I am seeing I need to replace those filters, but I can not find replacement filters for them. I bet I could make something with a nylon mesh pan scrubber. It will take me an hour with the eyebrow tweezers to get the dead root pieces out of this pump, and I have three pumps to clean. I think when these pumps quit working, I will go back to the cheaper smaller pumps and only use them one time and toss them. I could sell my crappy used old grow supplies on ebey like everyone else does. LOL

The smaller 140 gph pumps run cooler, are much cheaper at about $12 to $14, and deliver the trickle I need. I think they are more disposable too. These larger 240 gph pumps run hotter, cost $18 to $20 each, and the filters are too difficult to clean. I would never recommend any larger.

I am starting to see a lot of growers go to FILTER BAGS. A draw-string bag made of nylon screen, that the water pump sits in, to filter out the trash.

IF you use your same water pumps a 2nd time and have a pH problem, it might be the dead root particles trapped in your old water pumps.

I am taking these pumps apart and cleaning them as good as I can with a tooth brush and compressed air and some eyebrow tweezers.

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