Sr. Verde's: Concentrate Corner

Matt Rize

Hashmaster
is this for sure? if so i'd like to learn more.
not exactly, he over stepped the truth the adjectives. Yes butane and isoproanol are both polar, but their properties as solvents can be drastically different, especially if you look at the properties in relation to temperature. a large part of why hand grenades make such good bho is that those cans of gas get really cold when released.
 

oakley1984

Well-Known Member
Yes, I can read. :) 2g from 1z and 2.1g from another 1z = pretty much identical yields of the same product = same high = same potency = same. One person saying "god damn this one got me more high" isnt a test. Its one persons opinions. If we had 100 people try it we'd have a better field of opinions to choose from! :)


SrV: It isnt stripped by butane, butane is a non-polar stripper. I dont know about alcohols stripping properties but I'm sure it could be figured out..........

The only way the frozen pan will break when dropped in steaming hot water is if you missed the water and it landed on the floor. :) China Pyrex, dont matter. Its just borosilicate glass. Consider the temperature change. Your making it go from 0(F) to under 200(F) instantly. When I put borosilicate glass in front of my torch, it goes from 75(F) to over 1000(F) instantly too. THAT is a temperature change. :)

"China" glass is just the anti-christ for glassblowers. It doesnt make a difference in the final product, its just working it to BE the final product is more difficult and prone to cracking. Once its made, china glass is just as good as any other glass.


aside from doing a controlled test in a labratory where EACH cannabinoid was extracted to its own pure form, and then supersaturated in a controlled amount of each solvent, say 100ml and then reduced down. and weighed to test the solvency capability Per cannabinoid in the given solvent and this done for Every single cannabinoid, theres no Real way to tell for sure....

i had stated from the start this was my OPINION, if you dont like it, i dont care :)
 

Matt Rize

Hashmaster
Hate to say it but generally iso win for potency and bho for flavor/smoke in this comparison. Iso picks up less wax, obvious in the pics. Iso also comes out less waxy because there is no paraffin wax added like in those cans of gases.
 

Sr. Verde

Well-Known Member
Yes, I can read. :) 2g from 1z and 2.1g from another 1z = pretty much identical yields of the same product = same high = same potency = same. One person saying "god damn this one got me more high" isnt a test. Its one persons opinions. If we had 100 people try it we'd have a better field of opinions to choose from! :)


SrV: It isnt stripped by butane, butane is a non-polar stripper. I dont know about alcohols stripping properties but I'm sure it could be figured out..........

The only way the frozen pan will break when dropped in steaming hot water is if you missed the water and it landed on the floor. :) China Pyrex, dont matter. Its just borosilicate glass. Consider the temperature change. Your making it go from 0(F) to under 200(F) instantly. When I put borosilicate glass in front of my torch, it goes from 75(F) to over 1000(F) instantly too. THAT is a temperature change. :)

"China" glass is just the anti-christ for glassblowers. It doesnt make a difference in the final product, its just working it to BE the final product is more difficult and prone to cracking. Once its made, china glass is just as good as any other glass.

They don't make pyrex like they used to!

To quote Snopes.com, "Pyrex glass bakeware was originally made from borosilicate glass and is now made from tempered soda lime glass."

http://www.snopes.com/food/warnings/pyrex.asp



I've taken a pan out of the oven and placed it on a burner on low by accident.... 30 seconds later I realized my mistake, picked up the pan and it exploded in my hands :(


Thank god it was normal brownies, and nothing was lost :) I just had some glass embedded in my skin...

But I digress..... I just don't fuck with pyrex pans anymore..... Especially when concerning a few hundred bucks of oil sitting on the pan..
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
not exactly, he over stepped the truth the adjectives. Yes butane and isoproanol are both polar, but their properties as solvents can be drastically different, especially if you look at the properties in relation to temperature. a large part of why hand grenades make such good bho is that those cans of gas get really cold when released.
Dissenting opinion. Isopropanol is "middling" in terms of polarity but "frighteningly polar" for cannabinoid extractions imo.

Butane is as nonpolar as it gets, shy of perfluorinates. cn
 

oakley1984

Well-Known Member
exactly i never did this to piss anybody off. I did this for a comparative nature so everyone can see the end result of Both solvents when processed properly.
look at the results and see for yourself, if you want try it out! im happy to teach anyone how i process with iso
and what people are calling "quick wash" is most deffinatly Not my method.
 

Matt Rize

Hashmaster
Dissenting opinion. Isopropanol is "middling" in terms of polarity but "frighteningly polar" for cannabinoid extractions imo.

Butane is as nonpolar as it gets, shy of perfluorinates. cn
I shit I missed that. Isopropanol. I was talking about Isopropyl. I dont know jack about isopropanol. Dude, why not just make qwiso with dry ice? Thats the tops for purity at home. Wait now I see you just wrote iso. Which solvent is it now? I gotta start reading/typing slower.
 

Sr. Verde

Well-Known Member
I shit I missed that. Isopropanol. I was talking about Isopropyl. I dont know jack about isopropanol. Dude, why not just make qwiso with dry ice? Thats the tops for purity at home.

That's strange because I know isopropanol about jack..... :p
 

Matt Rize

Hashmaster
Dissenting opinion. Isopropanol is "middling" in terms of polarity but "frighteningly polar" for cannabinoid extractions imo.

Butane is as nonpolar as it gets, shy of perfluorinates. cn
The polarity and properties as a solvent are dependent on temps as much as anything. Try making tane with room temp tank n-butane, green oil... BHO from a can just so happens to work great because the compressed state of the gases and quick temp change of the extraction.

Again tops for home extractions are iso with dry ice, dripped thru a carbon filter. Ive never seen anything that quality from a home extract
 

oakley1984

Well-Known Member
I shit I missed that. Isopropanol. I was talking about Isopropyl. I dont know jack about isopropanol. Dude, why not just make qwiso with dry ice? Thats the tops for purity at home. Wait now I see you just wrote iso. Which solvent is it now?
Isopropyl alcohol (also Isopropanol, propan-2-ol, 2-propanol or the abbreviation IPA) is a common name for a chemical compound with the molecular formula C3H8O.

isopropyl, isopropanol, same thing... read the labels!

also, dry ice is a pain in the ass to get in my area. :(
 

oakley1984

Well-Known Member
but like they said above, isowhatever is not great at room temp. you doing a freezer extraction?
yes, thats correct. i freeze all material before hand... making sure the iso is as cold as the freezer will go
and the material, i freeze for 2wks or more before hand... i have found some supporting evidence and can link if absolutely necessary that cold temperatures in itself, Breaks down chlorophyll. This is why the extended duration for the material in the freezer... what people consider a "quick wash" by pouring into a jar and shaking for 10-30seconds... is insane. By the time they pour their iso into their jar, Im already done.


i really do invite people to take this challenge, see the results for yourself.
im laughing at the people sitting there saying how can you claim one is more potent than the other. well quite simple, have you tried it?(and no i dont mean this batch, a head to head comparison of iso vs butane) because I have.


i will make a video if needed to outline my method.
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
The polarity and properties as a solvent are dependent on temps as much as anything. Try making tane with room temp tank n-butane, green oil... BHO from a can just so happens to work great because the compressed state of the gases and quick temp change of the extraction.

Again tops for home extractions are iso with dry ice, dripped thru a carbon filter. Ive never seen anything that quality from a home extract
Solvent properties are temperature-dependent, yes ... but not polarity - it's a basic feature of the solvent, like molecular weight.

I have not yet tried butane at room temp ... but I will one day. My best analogous extractions have been with pentane and hexanes ... very close to butane in re polarity and solvency.
The greenest oils I have seen use aggressive solvents like acetone, dichloromethane and the alcohols. My hextracts are gold-yellow in dilution and brown when freed of solvent ... and they are tasty imho. I've never done a quick-wash myself, except as a "control" next to an exhaustive hextraction to determine efficiency.
Mind you; I am not seeking to argue. e.g. I would never argue with Oakley's results. But I do have experience with a wide array of solvents ... even some semi-exotic cannabis extraction experience. cn
 

jdro

Well-Known Member
I love the golden flakey dust i get to scrape off my okief after sitting for a few days after doing a couple runs. shit is so tasty!IMG_0211.jpg
 

Matt Rize

Hashmaster
"It is not commonly appreciated that retention indices are temperature dependent. It is even less common to express this fact in more practical terms by saying that polarity is temperature dependent. Although the meaning of both statements is identical, we believe the second to be particularly relevant, since the majority of practical gas chromatographers tends to handle polarity as an invariable characteristic of a stationary phase."
http://www.springerlink.com/content/f2g7v18165825701/

i think both the solute and solvent in the case of cannaextracts are temp dependent.
 

Matt Rize

Hashmaster
If a solvent will change phase from temperature changes, is it not possible to say temperature can drastically affect solvent properties ie liquid tane vs gas tane.
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
"It is not commonly appreciated that retention indices are temperature dependent. It is even less common to express this fact in more practical terms by saying that polarity is temperature dependent. Although the meaning of both statements is identical, we believe the second to be particularly relevant, since the majority of practical gas chromatographers tends to handle polarity as an invariable characteristic of a stationary phase."
http://www.springerlink.com/content/f2g7v18165825701/
Oho ... but gas chromatography is a different animal entirely. It does not really treat of the liquid phase of solvents. Also, since the temperature of the retained/fractionated vapor entity and the stationary phase's liquid component (typically a PEG wax) are both being changed, there is no real way to assign how much of what is a polarity effect. it's an equation in at least two variables.
Of course this is all tangential. I could be off in my count of angels on the pinhead. Solvent properties taken as a collective are definitely temperature-dependent ... hotter solvents are invariably "hotter" in their behavior. cn
 

cannabineer

Ursus marijanus
If a solvent will change phase from temperature changes, is it not possible to say temperature can drastically affect solvent properties ie liquid tane vs gas tane.
Of course. But I am abiding by a convention that only calls liquids "solvents". Supercritical extraction is a special case ... supercrit practitioners refer to the extractant phase as a "fluid" since it is neither liquid nor gas, but mixes properties of both. cn
 
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